Liquidity & Liquor - BitBoy Crypto | Investigating Sam Bankman-Fried & FTX (Largest Crypto Scam)

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Now, if any of these topics are interesting to you, you're going to love his show, how to write and deliver captivating speeches, how to market yourself into a new job, how design can help, and potentially hurt your revenue, and how to create a social media ad strategy that works. If these topics hit home in their things that you want to learn about, go listen to Marketing Made Simple wherever you get your podcasts. Today, you're going to hear an episode of my new podcast, liquidity and liquor. I co-host liquidity and liquor with Joseph Martin, a serial entrepreneur who sold his last company boxy charm for over $500 million. On liquidity and liquor, we have conversations about business, money, and life with some of the most interesting people in the world. You can download and subscribe to liquidity and liquor on YouTube or wherever you get your podcasts. So Ben, bit boy, I don't know it's funny because when people, when you're on crypto podcasts, people only call you bit boy. It's weird, yeah. I'm like, that's really fucking weird. Your name's Ben, but whatever. Okay, so Ben Armstrong, thank you, I appreciate you coming out. So you, I'm going to obviously let you sort of speak through your accolades in your story. Okay. But you have what, like 1.4 million on YouTube, you have a million on, so like millions of followers, you are arguably the gateway into crypto in North America. I know there's other channels that really do a good job of capturing it, but North America I'm pretty sure you're like. You're number one. You're number one. Overall, with all social reach of number one. That's bad ass. Okay. So, you even mentioned that this was not something that you've even been doing for a significant period of time. It's not 10 years. So, like, let's go through the Ben Armstrong origin story. Yeah. And it didn't start with crypto. So where to start? Yeah. So the Ben Armstrong origin story, you know, I was running side businesses and doing side hustles. You really got to go to back July 29, 2007, that's the day that I overdosed. And it's hard for people to really understand my story without understanding that's the centerpiece of my life. A lot of people say, you know, what was the best day of your life? You're like, I got three kids, it's when my kids were born, it's when my life, you know, said yes to being one of the only girls ever that would date me or whatever it is, you know. And, you know, but the best day for my, you know, this year in my life was the day that I overdosed and I don't want to rehab. So I was on like meth from 2000 to 2007, pretty much every day, like 17 to 24. And I overdosed as a hospital bed, like almost died and, you know, three days in a coma, eight days in ICU, it came out, went to jail and then got out of there and went to rehab. And so I ended up going to college, I got married, I did all that stuff afterwards, but like that was the center of my life. So you can't tell the Ben Armstrong origin story without understanding my life was really jacked up before, I've been to jail a bunch of times, all kinds of stuff. And then after that, finding peace and finding, you know, you know, a new reason to live, I guess, or not a new reason, like finding a reason to live, you know, I was out there killing myself every day. That's, that's what ultimately led me to where I'm at today. And I think going through that time, going through, I mean, a lot of people who have been through what I've been through, they're very successful, it's because just beating something like an addiction, it's one of the hardest things to do. And it was all the things that I learned while I was there in rehab that, you know, I've kept in my life and been able to keep me grounded and stuff like that. Like I'm just always thankful every day that I'm alive, you know, because I remember when I come in the hospital bed, like, shouldn't be alive right now, you know. And so that's, that's that piece of the story that leads me into, I worked in recovery, basically until after you recovered, you were helping out. Yeah. Yeah. So I worked in recovery. It didn't pay that great. The job that I had was executive director of a rehab facility for teenage boys. And so if you would have told me, like, what I'm doing today, like, you know, eight years ago, I've been like, there's no way that it makes sense. I don't even like finances boring. And so, but there's a lot of crossover between what I do now and what I did then because it's helping people. And that's what I'm really passionate about is helping people get into the truth of things, trying to help people change their financial futures. The first few years I was doing my channel, like I wasn't doing that because nobody was watching. But now, years later, you know, we have a bigger impact than we ever had. I have a bigger impact now than I had when I was actually working in nonprofit and recovery system. You have scale now. You have leverage. You have a channel. You have an audience. You have a community. What got you into crypto? So I was having to do a lot of side hustles along the way because I said I didn't pay that great. So I had a white label sports and concert ticket business. So I, it was a company called Ticket Network was the main company. It's a big company. A lot of the Ticket websites out there up underneath their umbrella. And so I had this hustle where I was selling tickets and it was going really well. All I did was drive traffic. I drove traffic. They did the payment process and they did the shipping. They did the listing. Once it, once they clicked my filing, it went to another page. So it was just purely driving traffic. What was going on Craigslist? What was it? 2011 was here. I started. 2011. So I started that and I was using an auto post on Craigslist because one thing I've always been really good at is scaling. Like nobody can out work me, you know, and I know how to build a team and I know how to lean on that team at leverage. And so I was able to scale from basically working at a car wash, making $25,000 a year at that time in 2011 to making $350K my second year doing the ticket business. Wow. Because I just, I scaled up so much of my first week. It's through like using marketing automation. I don't, I don't, I don't listing on Craigslist. I was using a product called Craigslist auto, auto poster. It's called clad genius and it was massive back then. I got to where I was posting 800,000 ads a day on Craigslist across Canada and the United States. Yeah. I had 16 laptops and I had like 10 different DSL connections. AT&T was like, what kind of drug operation are you doing here? You know what? They thought I was probably like North Korean hackers or something like that. And so anyways, the guy who ran it, well, he got sued by Craigslist. He lived in the Ukraine. So he didn't come over here and answer the lawsuit. Well, I can't took his website down to his payment processors. And so in 2012, he was like, ah, guys, I think you're going to have to start paying me this thing called Bitcoin. And I was like, what the second or third time I had to make my payment with it, I was like, I'm not doing this castage, you money gram. Like I literally went to Walmart and used money gram to send this guy in Ukraine cash because I like it was easier than Bitcoin. So much easier. Like it's not even funny how much easier it was. So we got into using back then you used Bit Mount Gox and Bit Instant. Mount Gox was the exchange. Bit Instant was kind of like a, I don't know, if you're into crypto, it's kind of like a layer two to Mount Gox's layer one. It's like, it would roll up transactions really quickly. And then it would just send the money and then it would catch up on the backend later. Kind of like a bank works. It's not the Swift system works with banking. So, so Mount Gox, Bit Instant was using that stuff. In 2013, you know, the prices were going up and I had six Bitcoin left in my account and it was $1,700 dollars. Now I was like holy crap, 17, not each, 17, 100 total. Total. But that's like early, early, early still. Well, my first Bitcoin purchase was $450 worth, 37 Bitcoin at the 1156 apiece or something like 12 bucks apiece basically. 12 $8 Bitcoin. Uh huh. Yeah, 37 Bitcoin, 12 bucks a Bitcoin. But I was using as a currency. You know, that's what you did in the early days. A lot of people got into you through Silk Road, but I'd been through my stuff. So I wasn't using Silk Road. I got in through this software. And so, um, you know, by the way, those who don't know Silk Road was where you buy drugs, right? Yeah. There was a guy out there who right now he's thinking to himself, God, I hope there's 30 caps that shrooms that I got for 100 Bitcoin, you know, it was really good. Yeah. Now he's got to take more shrooms to cover up the pain in the lot. Yeah. So anyways, 2013 price goes up. I sold six Bitcoin through a website called localbitcoins.com. I met with a guy at a McDonald's and over the Wi-Fi, I sent him the Bitcoin. I thought I was a genius. Like, I mean, I took my family down to Destiny. We went on a little vacation, I paid off a couple of bills. And, um, you know, it's so funny looking back. Well, the guy went to the wrong McDonald's first. So I was there in extra 30 minutes. And I just remember trying to look up on my computer, what is this Bitcoin? What is this Bitcoin mining? Everything will look at geocity site. Like, there was no education out there in 2013 about Bitcoin. I think there was one one YouTube channel Bitcoin Uncensored with Crystal Roads. I didn't know it existed. That time, I only knew it existed now because I ended up meeting the guy and talking to him at some point down the road. Um, but I just had this great opportunity in front of me and I didn't even, I couldn't see it and I couldn't understand it. And so that drives a lot of what I do today. It's trying to help people understand, uh, crypto. We, I've got a book catching up to crypto coming out, um, in January and the whole purpose of the book. They published by Wiley Publishing. They're the same people that published the Bitcoin standard, the number one Bitcoin book of all time. And they reached out to me and we're like, we think you got a lot to add. And so we started working on this book to go from a big, to go from your first day in crypto to a beginner. There's a gap there. Like when you make the dinner content in crypto, it's still over people's heads. Yeah. So we wrote this book in order to fill that gap. The other things I wish I knew when I got into crypto because it would have saved, I mean, I'd be a billionaire by now. I wouldn't be making cool YouTube content. I, you know, people wouldn't know me. I'd be on an island somewhere, but, um, you know, I'll take this life over that. It's all worked out. But at the same time, I don't want people to go through those same mistakes when the education is out there right now. So fast word, 2020, 2018, January, I decided to start my YouTube channel, started working on it in December of 2017, because I was just like, what the heck, I, 2017, I realized my mistake. You know what I got? I went all in on crypto, made some money, price went back down, whatever. I decided I wanted to get involved, so I created a character called BitBoy. Now BitBoy was a crypto superhero. It was not ever supposed to be BitBoy crypto. It was BitBoy and HODL. The HODL was his sidekick, it's like a turtle, right? HODL, people don't know. It's like a typo from a Bitcoin talk forum. It's what we say in crypto when you keep your crypto, you HODL it. And so it was supposed to be this like, you know, crypto crime fighting duo, we were going to do an anime cartoon series. And then I learned how to animate it. I was awful at it. I learned how I've got some, I got some animation on the channel, people go back and look at the early days, did some voiceover stuff, but the time ROI was not there. I would spend in like a week and a half, making 30 seconds of a video. Yeah. Yeah. And nobody wanted, it was the peak of the market. It was going down, nobody wanted anything fun. And so my buddy was like, you should start doing, you start doing crypto news. So he said, you understand crypto very well, maybe a little bit understood back then. I thought I did. And he said, you got a very easy way of talking and communicating with people that makes them understand things that are high level on a low level and so go, okay, cool. So start doing news videos. And then I would do interviews and over time, when people come on my channel, they would call me BitBoy. And that's how I ended up becoming an almost 40 year old man, now I am 40 named BitBoy. And it's a little, like on one hand, it's a little humiliating, you know, they're like, what are you going to become a bit man? I'm like, no, you don't understand. It wasn't supposed to be like this, but it's like on the other hand, like it's great branding and people know us and it's like, you really can't, can't beat the branding that we built in crypto. Why in 2022, we're still, because the book you're putting out is still solving for problems that we've had 10 years to solve for. So the first mile in learning crypto and blockchain and defying crypto and every other iteration thereof, it's still super murky and it's very hard to figure out. And then obviously we can talk about all the bullshit that happens in the industry that obviously doesn't lend a lot of trust for people to understand it. Why have we still not made it easier that first mile? What's, is it the UI UX of the actual exchanges? Is it Coinbase has the shittiest customer service in the world as a tech company, not just as a crypto company. Why are all these hurdles there? Yeah, well, I think there's, there's two things that tend to hold people back that I think are, they need to conceptually understand. One of them is Bitcoin mining. Like when people get into crypto and they hear about Bitcoin mining, like everybody's first thought is like, oh, I can do that, I can put her, you know, I can pick my mind. And then you start looking into it and you're like, what is this? My head's going to explode. Like I don't understand Bitcoin mining on a technical level. I've never done Bitcoin mining. We've considered doing it as company, but people get, and honestly, that was the thing that I, when I was researching Bitcoin, I was like, I can't understand this. I don't know what this means. And so when I say for people to conceptually understand Bitcoin mining, it's, you actually need to understand it. It's not important. You understand it. You need to under, if you're investing, it's in, not financial advice, if you're investing, it's important, certainly to understand the way that the Bitcoin cycles work price-wise in relation to Bitcoin mining, because that's very, that's, to me, that's the most important thing I crypto. But don't let things like Bitcoin mining hold you up. You don't have to understand stuff on technical level. And I always use this example, like the HTTP protocol, I think the P stands for protocol, whatever it is. I don't even know what HTTP stands were. I don't know. I use it every single day. I use it every day. Everybody uses it every day. You don't understand. I would totally tell you I just don't want to brag. So I'm going to keep it for myself. Perfect. I like that. I'm really humble. Yeah. I get the next 100x coin. I'm going to keep it in my pocket too. But that's one thing is Bitcoin mining and just, it really goes further to like people thinking they have to understand on a deep technical level what's happening with Bitcoin. And you don't. Really it's more important if you don't understand money. And that's the gap. People don't understand money at all. Like I learned, I had no idea what money was when I first got into this. Number two, the word cryptocurrency is a really bad word. I hate the word cryptocurrency. There are so few coins in the world of crypto, there are actually a currency that confuses people. People are like, I'm investing in a theorem like, I don't understand, am I going to be using it as money? People equate currency with money. And for good reason, currency and transactions in crypto are different than currency and transactions in the real world. Okay. And what I mean by that is this, the Ethereum network. Okay. When we talk about transactions per second, TPS, it's why it's so important that we upgrade Ethereum to make it faster, a transaction in crypto is anything that interacts with the blockchain. Right. Even including things called micro transactions are very, very, very minute. You also have gas fees whenever you buy an NFT on Ethereum, like you've got a gas fee that must be paid in Ethereum, even if you were buying it on a different chain like Polygon or something like that. Or a better example would be, if you're buying something with USDC, if you're sending money with USDC and it's built on top of the Ethereum blockchain, you still have to use actual Ethereum to push that through, because USD is one of the changes built on. When we think of a transaction in the world, and we think the semester card, which does, I think it's 1700 transactions per second is what Visa does. It's not extremely high. And we're talking about it in crypto, we need 100,000 per second. Well, what's a transaction with Visa? You're putting a hold on a credit card, you're buying a burger, you're paying for your haircut. There's goods and services that we're paying for, and then a few other things like holds. That's it. In crypto, every single thing is a transaction. So if you were to equate that to the real world, let's say a hotel ran on Ethereum, for instance, which is a mythical situation, like when you open your door with your key, that's a transaction. When you go to the elevator, that's a transaction. Everything that you do on a blockchain is a transaction as opposed to in the real world, we're only using it for goods and services. So that's why the word cryptocurrency exists. It is a currency because you're using it in every single thing that you're doing, but you're not using it the same way we use regular money. And that confuses the crap at people. So I prefer the word crypto assets. So Ben, here's a question from someone that's not an investor in them. But looking at Bitcoin and Ethereum, or just a crypto world, it was supposed to be a mechanism to protect us from a collapse, and it's proven to not be that. For now, well, went down with the stock market, right? Went down the bear market, took everything down with it, including the value of Bitcoin. Just literally anyone that put a dollar over there versus say, if you put a dollar on the S&P at the height, it would probably be better to start the S&P when even a little bit more. Now it's what 12 years in the making. Maybe I'm wrong. 13 years in the making. I was 14. The question I have about this is not to go and say it's not going to go and save us one day from a Doomsday, from government emergency, I'll drop it in the middle. Let's hear it. Why are the KPIs in your mind to say, OK, this is now when we still don't have a proof of concept because X, Y, Z, or here are the proof of concept already. It's not just our own investors. Oh, there's so much unpack here. There's so much unpack. Anyway, any of the assumptions that he made, you can also like, you don't have to agree with it. Oh, yeah, I'm going to destroy these assumptions. But I don't want to stay on the front and I understand why you think all this. What you're thinking is what almost everybody thinks, including people in crypto, but they're all wrong, and it's very easily provable wrong, OK? You're always in this state in Bitcoin, because it's a four year cycle, and we'll talk about that. I'm sure at some point, you're always in a state of the price dropping dramatically during a bear winter, which this will now be the... But I would consider really the third massive crypto bear market. There was a smaller one in the beginning, but we've had three cycles now, and it drops so dramatically that people can only look at the micro of what's happened in the last four years. So you're looking at Bitcoin at $70,000, and today you're looking at it at, you know, 16 or 17. Man, we had a pump at 17,000. Let's go. We have somewhere around there, and you're saying like, but look, it was this price. OK, well, let's go back a little bit further. Let's go back six years ago. What was the price? Oh, six years ago, the price was $1,100, holy crap. This is actually an incredible store of value when you look over just a little bit longer, but we're always comparing Bitcoin to what it just did. You're not comparing it to what it did six years ago, or eight years ago. And because of that, we stay locked in this like, up, Bitcoin's a scam. Look, it went down. It was up this high. So how to stop looking at it in terms of the most recent high and the most recent low, and look at it over time. If you look at the Bitcoin chart over its history, it's immeasurable. So if you're saying, you're saying, look, it's only 12 years. If you look at the US dollar currency, how many years, at 100 and so many years, go and put it as a same perspective, it's going to get more and more stabilized. It's time to go by and you look at this as a metrics and you say, look, this is where it was a few years ago, even a very tough bear market where we are now. We're still 10X than what we wore six years ago. Yes, I am saying that, but what I'm also saying that's kind of another layer to that is we just stay trapped in the mindset of the last four years all the time. And until we do get much less volatility and these Bitcoin cycles don't bear out the way they've always existed throughout time, we're never going to look outside of the most recency bias that we have. And so a good example of this is your stock market comparison. Bitcoin did not go down because of the stock market, like to say that is to fundamentally misunderstand the history of Bitcoin. I understand once again, I understand why you think you look at the chart and it seems to line up. But it's weird. Let's go back to 2018. 2018, Bitcoin had a worse fall than it's had now. And what was this stock market doing in 2018? Was it dropping? Was it getting crushed? It was going up. It was going up. Not quite as dramatically as it was in, let's say, 2017 or 2019, 2018 was not a super massive year for the stock market, but it was a good year for the stock market. And when you look back at Bitcoin and you look at that time, it dropped 85%. This narrative, this talking point about the macro is crushing Bitcoin. It drives me insane. This is the third cycle, the third super bear market. The last two both had 85% drawdowns with inflation, pandemic, fed rate hikes or everything we've got going against Bitcoin. It still has fallen less than it fell the last two times. Yeah. I think when you look at the crypto market or some that really died almost, I mean, if you look at Solana, where it came from, where it is today, compared to Bitcoin, and now again, I would have the second question to come down to it because I expected you to defend, and I actually thought about that. The second part would be, look, approval upon it. Don't you ask me questions? You know, the answer to already. No, I don't know the answer. I was expecting an emotional reaction, but we checked it. Well, alright, so then the second part that I wanted to ask, alright, so then the second, and I'm speeding someone else's words. So I think it was Jordan Belford at the time he said, well, you know, the blockchain as a whole makes sense. Absolutely. However, as long as you have mostly investors trading the coin, it is still just a tradable asset or on investors. Once we're going to actually use it for the day-to-day, that's when you have a proof of concept and we're not there yet. And what's your take on that one? Oh, great. 100%. I don't disagree with that at all. You would say it would be a key indicator to say, okay, now we have a proof of concept. People are actually buying bread with this, the transactions are not going to be- No, and crypto, we talk about buying a cup of coffee. Yeah. Crypto is no good unless you go buy a cup of coffee with it. That's a little meme in crypto, like I always laugh, because for some reason it's like, I'm glad you said bread, because they always say coffee. I laugh at that too. Yeah, I mean, I'm never going to say coffee. I'm going to be original. Yeah, exactly. I Google that to say no, change it to bread. I like the original. Well, it's because it's a money show. So you know, you got to get that. Exactly. Obviously. The whole thing is, when you look at where we're at in crypto, you're not early in investing in crypto. I do not believe you look at the numbers, you're not an early, an early doctor of investing in crypto. However, we started a time where people are early investors in learning what crypto is and learning about crypto. And that obviously puts you at a huge massive advantage against everybody else. If you understand what you're talking about and you understand what you're investing in. So when it comes to the adoption curve of main, I think mainstream adoption is a mean too, right? If you asked people last year at the same time, you know, what when Bitcoin was about at 70K, like, oh, you know, what's going on mainstream adoption? It's here. It's never going down again. We told people last year we're going to have a bear market. We have it every four years. Everyone's there. Yeah. Yeah. So the whole thing is we're going back to my conversation about currency versus asset. We don't have that many coins or currency. Bitcoin is not a currency, more folks. Bitcoin is digital gold. Okay. So even its use case has been changed from what it was intended as. You look across the board and you look at all these other assets. Like some of these aren't ever even going to find their use case because the founders made so much money on speculation, on speculation, they've got founders to limo. What's their motivation to keep building a project that's already made them a billion dollars that they don't really have it? So I think what we're going to see is we're going to continue to see more projects die, right? Yeah. Solano, centralized blockchain, I believe it is going to die. I've never considered Solano to be a mate. We consider it to be a good investment at one time. We didn't consider it to be a real competitor to Ethereum. You got Ethereum, you got Cardano, you got Algrant, ICP, HBAR. These are coins that we invest in. I'm invested in for transparency, but those are kind of like some of the coins that we look at. We say these are going to do pretty well. XRP is another one, but it is in a different niche than these. We call these layer one blockchains that I'm talking about. If you look at what's built on these layer one blockchains, none of them are super, none of them are optimal right now. They still have a long ways to go. You look at things like NFTs and Metaverse. We think we're probably eight years away from Metaverse actually being a thing that's not a meme. You know, a thing where people are using it. We're still so early. Did you buy land in the Metaverse? Oh, I've got a lot of land in Sandbox. We bought a lot of land in Sandbox because we are building in Sandbox. We do have a lot of Metaverse land, Everdome's another one that we have some land in. But we built an entire digital city in there. We've got a big space and we've got a game like where we have BitBoy avatars and the little bitverse characters that were the characters I created for the comic series there in it. And we've got a little game where you go around trying to find these bitcoins for some gorilla. Like, it's not out yet. People can't see it yet because the alpha for Sandbox is not complete. But yeah, we. Wasn't that too early, though? Well, if you could go back in time. Why would you know, we've been building it for two and a half years and we still don't have the land built out. We have professional Minecraft builders that have been there building for two and a half years. So by the time it hits, we've already built. So no, I would disagree now. In a different world, you're in a different round than other people that just vote something next to Snoop Dogg, a million dollar and all that, either way. Well, a lot of people may money. I mean, if you bought it the peak, you didn't. But a lot of that real estate will go up and buy it. Even if we're eight years away from like real adoption of Metaverse, like you're still going to see the value of the real estate go up every market cycle. The important thing for you is to learn how to time the market cycles. Take profits. People are still buying them on Sandbox. Sandbox, most of the land is already sold, but there are secondary markets. Yeah. I mean, our land that we bought for $50,000, I believe these numbers correct, $50,000, I think, at the peak. It was like two and a half million. And then right now, I have no idea what it is right now. I'd probably say it's still probably somewhere around a million dollars, so we got prime real estate over there. But we didn't buy it as an investment. We bought it to build on it and we're going to make money inside of our Metaverse or inside of our land, like whether it's selling avatars or selling NFTs, all this stuff we had to pay to get developed, so we've got costs in it. But selling NFTs, selling met, you know, exclusive meetups, I don't know what to say. Yeah, I'm going to ask you a question about that and we're completely derailing. I'm going to let you go. Yeah. I know. I know. I know. Just ask. Aren't you worried that tomorrow, Apple is going to come up with their own space or Facebook is going to come up with your own space and then Sandbox is going to disappear? No. Because they're centralized. It's everything. It's going to be an ethical decrypto, like the reason why these Metaverses will be such a big deal is because they are decentralized in a sense and you're not having to give over all your data to Apple. I agree. This data game is over. How much do you think a kid, how much do you think a kid that goes to play a video game cares about centralized and decentralized where they have a fake character called JJ123? I'm going to play a video game and shoot some zombies. No, that's a centralized. Do you really think they're going to care? Well, it's not really kids that are playing it right now. That's part. This is people that do carry things. It's people that do care, but look, we have got to draw hard lines. My kid's privacy is ruined for generations. That's true. So at some point, us, the Facebook generation, millennials and older, we got to draw hard lines and say, we're going to stop giving them all this stuff. That's why everyone hates Facebook. Facebook's metaverse is going to be one of the most gigantic failures of all time. People are done with the Facebook game. Facebook had to actually come up with a strategy. For holding, stay at home mom meetups to try to get 11, 12 and 13 year olds interested in Facebook. I don't know if you guys know. That's a real story. No, I don't know. That's a real story. What did they do? Facebook marketing came up with this idea to create spaces for stay at home moms to have basically play dates with other moms in hopes that they could recruit their kids to be friendly to Facebook. Oh, really? Wall Street Journal. Go check it out. Interesting. That's a real story. That's how down Facebook is. No, they're in such a horrible spot. There's no way they get out of this because now what's up is the one thing that they have. Of course, Instagram is another thing they have. Those two things probably survive and do well. Facebook is currently constructed or anything that has the word Facebook or meta. It's dead. Everybody hates it. If you're a millennial or older, well, your grandma might like it, but I'm sorry. Like, your grandma, she might be 84. Like, I love her, but she's not going to get it. You don't want to be in the same party with her. That's nice. She's not going to be around forever. Everybody that's like 60 and under 50 and under, especially hates Facebook. Kids hate Facebook because when they were growing up, their parents like Facebook. There's no win for Facebook going forward. The Oculus is certainly the only hope they have within this meta world. But even within that one, one of the characteristics of the word metaverse of a definition, if you actually look it up, is user generated content, right? Facebook is trying to build a video game. They're not trying to build a real metaverse because they have to give up control of what goes on there. They're never going to do that. That's the thing with centralization. These companies, they want to control every transaction that would have their own internal economies with their own little coin that's not that you can't send off. We're not going to be able to take whatever coin is in a centralized metaverse, earn that coin, and then withdraw it to somewhere else. You're going to have to live within that economy. Metaverse is about reaching out from that. This is probably so far where people's heads, because this is... It's going to dovetail into centralization versus decentralization on all the fuck up. It's actually a good point. Let's bring it back. No, no, no. You are all you. I know. No. We're going over to questions and there are a lot of... No, no, no. We can go right in. I don't know if you want to go into SBF and FTX right away. The other stuff that I thought was interesting is that you are a personality and you have a group of people that love you, a group of people that hate you, absolutely hate you. I watched the bankless podcast and they were just not... They were not... They were not fans or whatever, anyways. So I thought it was an interesting show because it's kind of like a hit piece. Then when I asked people to ask you questions, because I threw it up on Instagram, one of the guys equated you to the Jim Kramer of crypto saying that as long as if I picked something that he doesn't pick, then I'm good. Yeah. So there's a lot of anger and emotion. So maybe just speak to why that is. I'm so off the neck, it's not even funny. When I am an overshare and I'm overly honest and I'm overly anxious to give my opinion on things. It just gives people so much more to shoot at because let's say you like Salana, okay? For instance, I came out, there's really bad stuff happening with Salana. There's been bad stuff happening on the back end, so I'm telling you what's real. I'm also giving you my opinion on it. And now everybody in the Salana community hates me, you know? And so when you look at other coins that I've talked about in the past that I basically have built up this engine of like every time I say something negative, I'm adding more people to the people that hate me, but like I'm not going to lie, I'm just going to tell you what I think. Number, that's one aspect of it. Another aspect of it is, once again, we go back to these four year cycles, prices going up, prices going down, well, there's a spreadsheet that somebody made about all my picks that I've ever made. Number one, we really, we made way too many picks in 2020, like that was a big problem. We got to know each other. You even said actually on that podcast, I listened to you, like you're starting to change your business money. Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah, well, we have much bigger responsibility and accountability for it. And like if people can't tell that I deeply, passionately care about crypto in the future of the world and its relationship, then they're just blind. They're hatred blinds them. Like it's so obvious to see how much I care about all this. And so going through this process, going somebody that went from 10,000 subscribers to a million and a half in 16 months, I made some mistakes. Like we did sponsor videos that I wish I wouldn't have done. It was never like, oh, like this register scam, I want to promote it. It's like, no, we had a research, we did some due diligence, but it's such a new emerging time. I'm going to jump about that because you're saying, look, you sponsor someone. They turn out to be false. You wish you didn't do it, but even though you research, you couldn't find. So say Kevin O'Leary, okay? Kevin O'Leary, FDX, okay. You mentioned something, Kevin O'Leary, you're a very opinionate about Kevin O'Leary listening. Well, it's because of that person, but yeah. Yeah, so it's just he supported FDX. Now he's silent. Yeah, so say Kevin, he hasn't been silent. He's still been saying Sam is a great guy and he supports what he does. Oh, wow. Okay. There's multiple clips of him. How do you mean to interrupt you? But like, that's the fact. Okay. So that changes my question, but I will still go back to the same question because assuming he was paid in one way or another, net, you know, not knowing that everything was the scam. And now it was a scam. Like, isn't that like, look, it happens. I guess he can't really blend what? Well, now if he's still supporting that guy, double down, yeah, that's it. Well, there's plenty of other people that fit into this category. You're talking about the way that Tom Brady, Graham Stefan, they've been in this category because I see where you're going with this question, which is, how can I sit here and say like, no, that's specifically about you because at least you stand out and you said, look, I'm a mistake, but if you said they still double down and support the guy, I'm not deeply into it. So I can't really tell you how to research. But if the guy doesn't, if the guy said, listen, man, I like this company. You get paid and then eventually, oops, it's falling down. I don't want to talk about this right now. Maybe legal obligation, whatever it is, contractual obligation to just be quiet. Like, is it really, what's your opinion? Like, just let the guy with the hook, he's at least not saying anything. Yeah, for sure. I'm in a total, I have not, I have not attacked one person for promoting FTX. We never promoted FTX. We never had an affiliate, I don't believe we ever had an affiliate link for FTX. We've never had an account at FTX. We did think the FTT coin, we bought it on Kucoin. We thought it was going to do really well last year and be like, oh, yeah, you get new information and you change your opinion. It's not rocket science, right? But we knew about this in solvency several weeks before anybody else did. We were shocked. Like, I would have promoted FTX if they came. We went to them for funding for our bill in Congress. Like, we thought they were good actors or I was always in the middle on Sam. I never was like, he's definitely good or he's definitely bad. I could never make up my mind on him and that's clearly document in the history of my channel. I did always say he had a really bad haircut, but outside of that. I don't attack Graham Stefan. What I didn't like about what Graham Stefan did about promoting FTX is when I went on his iced coffee hour podcast, whatever it's called, maybe it was early last year. And the comments just like, you see, there's a whole community of people that have to hate me. They all came in the comments like, he's a scammer. He's pumping a diamond. And blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Stuff that's not true. We've never done a video to promote a coin and sold the coin within probably a week or two. We've never done it. We've never done it. But when you look at the chart, it looks like that sometimes because people took profits or if we just sponsored a video, the price on the back end would be the one that's doing interesting. It was me being naive. Well, if you're an influencer and the founders like allocate a huge marketing budget to you, then they're like, okay, this is going to be it. Well, he puts it out, founders sell at the peak. There you go. That's the misdirection smug and mirrors peel on our skin. And then you're the face and then you get you get all the shit for it and the founders here. And the people who invested lose because they're watching the videos and they think it's going to go up. And then I lose. And the founders, they went because they had the majority of the selling one winner and that. There's only one winner. So that's why I really came out very strong against token and coin promotions. Now, I don't think anybody should be doing promotions of coins that have a speculative value on them. But that's another conversation. Graham Stefan in his comment section, him and his partner Jack, I don't know who was responsible for it. But they basically went, they were just like, apologists in the comments like, I'm sorry. We didn't know he's super controversial blah, blah, blah, blah. He's like, how about a little support, guys? Like I was there face to face with you. You didn't call me. You had my phone number, Graham could have texted me. You could have said like, oh, like there's a lot of, you know, what about this stuff going on? Like, you know, is there any truth to it? How about come ask me instead of just go in the comments and say, they lost that an opportunity. When you get that much activity, you bring the person back on and you walk 100 percent. You walk. Do a fucking follow up. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Why not? Yeah. Yeah. It's a stressful thing. It's not for everyone. And I can tell you sitting from the side of it, one time I get criticized over a campaign I made with one influencer that said something 10 years before, something like that, and somehow, I would have never find out what you said. Yeah. And it's like, I get blamed for something that I had no idea that happened in the past. And this is not a crypto. This is not something you can actually find information. Yeah. So then when that it is, it does happen. I mean, it's a stressful situation, not everyone in the list, but at least there was a phone call. And then it was never really to put down a person, it was just talking in general about the topic. And that's it. Yeah. I think that's important. And so like, I, I, Graham learned a lesson there is that, you know, don't throw stones glass houses. Like, yeah, you actually ended up, and once again, I'm not criticizing him for promoting. I do not blame Graham at all, I don't blame any person for promoting FTX. Nobody knew. And when people find out the real truth of everything is behind this thing with FTX that I know they're going to be like, this is so much bigger than anybody thought. No, but people that worked very close to the inside didn't even know. Some did. I can't criticize for that. But what I do criticize them is not for staying up for me at all and just assuming that he had all the right answers and that he's promoting great stuff. He promoted the greatest financial fraud in human history. So many people are guilty of that. They didn't know, but let's have the same kind of, um, leniency isn't the right word, but let's have the same kind of care and human understanding for people to understand. Empathy. Empathy. The world out. You're trying to do the same stuff and none of us, certainly after this debacle, none of us are perfect. I promoted Celsius, 99% of the time when I promoted Celsius, it was organically. We didn't even say we had a link for it. Just we made $3,000 on promoting Celsius in three years. That's nothing in the world of what I do for nothing. It was a horrible affiliate program. But we talked about all the time because we believed it and we thought it was great. Same thing. Like we all have got to learn a lesson from this and this is the, I hope that this is the galvanizing moment for people that talk about crypto, people in the financial world, where we all look and say, we all have to do better and we all have to work together. If you know someone is a bad actor, if you can prove someone's a bad actor and you're supporting them, that's a different thing. The vast majority are out here just trying to do the best that we can all the time and everybody's made mistakes. I think now we can kind of go back to the drawing board and say, knowing what we know now, how can we protect our audience better going forward? Well, I mean, if you want to equate it to other huge financial fuck-ups, like Bernie Maidoff was on boards, right? Like regulators, what board was he on? I can't think of the board at the top of my head. He legislated. He was trying to say what it was. But the point is, I'm just a lot of people that look back on that and they're like, okay, we kind of fucked up here. Well, I think his brother worked for other regulators, too, or some of the praise, though. It was a while. I think the reason with him is just he did rip off only really, really wealthy people over here. It was ripping off mom and pop, someone that just works out of a garage and they just support. Yeah. And that's the... Well, a lot of those people got paid back, I believe, with Bernie Maidoff, with the Maidoff situation. Yeah. He served on the board of directors and served on the federal regulation committee that basically had the greatest impact on like securities laws and regulations. It's so crazy. It's fucking wild. Yeah. So you talk about influencers talking about a coin, well, let's look at what else has happened in history. Yeah. I want to actually think about comparables because to Maidoff, to Enron, to other huge financial fuck-ups and frauds and whatnot. How much money was actually lost with FTX? Well, it depends on who you're asking and what installments you hold, you're going down. By the way, this entire conversation is allegedly. Yes. I'm not willing to say that. Sorry, FTX. Come sue me. I don't give an F. Good luck. See, people wonder why I come out so bold against people, because I know what they've done. And they don't want to go to discovery with me in a lawsuit. See me, Kevin? I see Kevin O'Leary looking at me right now. Come sue me, Kevin. You want me to go do a full investigation on the deaths of in Toronto? I'm just saying, I know he doesn't want me to do that. But the fact is, when you look at the installments, the number of those who are thrown out is 8 billion. Yeah. There's another number where people would say there were $14 billion and there were $900 million in liquid assets. But when you actually expand and you look out across the entire financial world that they were touching, people put the estimate somewhere around 50 billion dollars. Right. Yeah. When you add in your block. They were invested in 225 major crypto companies. Not all of them, some in the finance world, like between 200 and 250, maybe 225 companies. I've got the document. I see every time they invested in every other company. Plot to block. So, coming after them, because look, he's the second largest donor to Biden. There was no federal investigation, which is weird. The entire mainstream media was positive about, still is about him. It comes for a reason. Now, you have a YouTube channel, you see people that can rotate, say something against their own guy, disappear, cancel the bank account, freezes up their assets. Don't you have that self-preservation a little bit when you talk about FDX a little bit like that? No. I don't. I'm not scared of these people at all. Let me tell you the last thing. I'm never really not worried. You're really not. The last thing I'm ever scared about is a nerd coming after me. I can tell you that. Yeah, but it's not going to be a nerd coming. It's not the nerd. That's a whole point. It's a US government, perhaps. Parents that kept them doped up all those years of what it is. Let me just not scare. If I end up being a martyr, so be it. What are you going to take a picture to get off to? I want to make sure. For proof of life. For proof of life. Here's the thing. I'm built differently than most people. I don't have fear when it comes to this kind of stuff because I feel like I'm fighting a righteous battle. I feel like I'm on a God-given mission and I'm going at these people and I will not stop and I will be relentless. I always say you go back to the Catholic church in the 1400s and you say this is the most corrupt organization that ever exists in the history of mankind. They use the Bible, burn you a nest on the stake, that's what. Burn you a nest. They use the Bible where they were the only people that could read it and so they had all the information. If you would have told them with the next two to three hundred years, Catholic church would pretty much go, could put, I mean, it still exists, but not in the same power structure that it did. Those people told you were crazy. They said, you're fighting the wrong fight. You can't do this. But what happened? The printing press came out and within a hundred years, the printing press came out, people started reading. And those people could read. They could see holy crap. Look at what these people are doing to us. We're in the new age of the printing press. I'm not saying anything that people don't know. Like the mainstream media thing is so funny because if you go and you look, I've been a poll-outer poll-outer poll. Ninety-four to 96 percent of people believe St. Benjamin Fried is a terrible person and he does not deserve a second chance in crypto. Okay. Ninety-four to 96 percent. If you go look at the comments on threads, it doesn't fit that because SPF and FTX are now made to have a gigantic bot army and propaganda army and we're going to be doing an exposay on this and proving this in the next couple of months. But when you look at the mainstream media and you look at the New York Times, you look at the Washington Post, you look at the Washington Journal, you look at Forbes, how is it that they have the opinion of the only four percent of people have? Oh, I was just four percent anyway. I believe most of them are people that misclicked. I think the number on those polls is actually smaller. I think it's only one to two percent. I think... Yeah. Just you read the Forbes headlines and I think one of the articles was trying to equate the Alameda shitshow to far right wing conspiracy shit like that. And it was just like, it's just like you're reaching so hard and it's embarrassing at this point. And you know what's actually depressing? It's a little bit depressing because like you look at even... I don't like listen. It's firing out. There's WSJ and there's all these other outlets. But then you look at things like Forbes and you're like, how are you fucking this up? I just like going to you for business news. Stop fucking up stuff like this. Well, it's individual journalist. Gretchen Morgan sent us an NBC journalist that we love and she reports that she's hardcore and like, she goes through an editor. She said she is... She told me she's never had someone take whatever pieces and ruin it. She's an independent journalist. She works for them but Gretchen, I hope you're kidding me saying this, but she says that she's never had problems with having to send things through an editor and getting it debunked. It's other people writing stories. It's not one entity at the top and I think it's because they know if they control all their reporters, then they're not going to get, you know, this is going to get much worse for them. When you look at somebody like Andrew Ross-Sorkin from New York Times, this guy's bought off. He's been bought off by SBF in the Fried Bankman family forever. He's been paid off by Goldman Sachs. I know this. He's literally been paid by the banks to have certain opinions and he literally lies in his articles and makes stuff up. So there memes at this point. This is not depressing. But it is, but that's my point. It's so bad. It's not like- But it's so bad. It's so bad. It's good. Yeah, I see what you're saying. We hit. Listen. I have almost single handedly from documentary writers that we've started. I've created a new brain of journalism in the last month. It is. I'm going to kick your door down. I'm going to get the information. If you don't give it to me, I'm going to start a Twitter spaces. I'm going to have people outside your house. I'm going to have Twitter talking about you so bad, you're not going to be able to get off the mat. Give me the information now before I have to take it. This is a kind of journalism that we've not seen before. Andrew Ross Sorkin does not have an army of people behind him going to fight for him. He has zero of those people. Nobody likes the New York Times. He's got the people that like to do the crosswords, which I don't know if you don't know this Sam Trabucco that was a CEO of Alameda. He wrote a lot of the crosswords for the New York Times. That's funny. I didn't know that. Of course. Nobody knows that. Nobody sees the cross over there. But this kind of journalism, and I'm dead serious about pushing this further and further is we are at a precipice in the history of media. We have defeated the mainstream media now. The mainstream media is officially dead. I'm calling it dead today on what date is it? What date is it today? On Wednesday, November 30th, the day I'm recording this, the mainstream media, the New York Times, Washington Post, they are dead. The new future of journalism, the new future of investigative reporting is on YouTube and it's on Twitter and it's on Rumble and it's on all these platforms. No one believes what they say. No one. So this is actually a great, really inspirational, motivational thing for people to say, let's push those people aside, let's make them totally irrelevant. I understand if you want to answer 42 across the New York Times, crossword puzzle, but you better not be going to them for information, they don't have it. I can in five minutes right now, I can go on Twitter, and I can ask my community for documents, addresses, phone numbers, any information I want. If it exists, it'll be in my box in five minutes. See crowdsourcing. That's it. That's it. It's crowdsourcing journalism. Yeah. Exactly. I asked for information on Barbara and Joe Bankman or Joe Bankman, Sam Bankman parents, Sam Bankman, Fried's parents. You're getting Barbara's up. I do. I do. I do. I do get a real emotional about this stuff, but Barbara Fried and Alan Joseph Bankman, his grandparents have basically been scrubbed from the internet. Is it, hey, can somebody find me information on that grandparents? I had it within five minutes. I think it was Home Addresses. They're. Wow. You got to be careful with that. Well, that's the thing. That's the thing. That's where people are. I'm not giving Home Addresses out. I'm going to get answered. It's a reporter. I can do that. So I don't have to be careful. That's what reporters do. I mean, sometimes I get calls from reporters related, buting this Wednesday, they're really, they can be very, they'll stack me until I just tell them, leave me alone completely and I'll hang up the phone, but they'll try to get information. So it's not wrong. It's only turning wrong when you use this. If you dox information, and I do not dox information, like I'm not asking for this stuff to tell people to go people's houses. I want to recruit people to go down to the Bahamas in protest. I want to do that. I want to go stand right outside of Deltech Bank, right outside of the government office, right outside of the Albany, and have a gigantic protest. See, this is what I think you should think about that, because that is my point behind look, that's a person that's probably protected by people that you might not want to piece off. That was my point. We were right up to his house. He's not. It was a moment. It was a moment. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And the security guard didn't even want to kick us out. People there don't like him. Interesting. They have to, they only are having to do their job because you got Joe and Barbara up at the top floor. He's live right now, remove them, remove them, remove them. Now, look, I'm not scared of these people at all, and I'm going to continue to push. I'm going to continue to go further and further and further. They're going to have to kill me to shut me up. Now, you got to, you got to Twitter spaces set up with him? Well, supposedly, as I responded to me in 48 hours now, so we'll see. Now, he's doing a couple other shows. I told him the question. I told him the question. How many people are coming to Twitter spaces when you? Well, the last few we've had between, I think, maybe six and 10,000 or so. On each episode? But while it's live. While it's live. Yeah, really? Yeah, that's just on Twitter spaces. We average probably around seven K on our YouTube live streams every day, even when this stuff isn't going on. It really killed the clubhouse, huh? Yeah. Well, Clubhouse wasn't a proprietary technology, so from the very beginning, that's why I never got bit on Clubhouse. It's where it's based on where we're only now starting to really understand the power of is a company. My time is just so, it's so, I'm here for two hours. It's hard for me to be here for two hours. I got it. My time is just so few and far between. So I've been running for like seven days straight, like non-stop. And probably longer than that, probably 10 days straight. And finally today, I was like, I'm going to stay in the hotel room. I'm going to sleep. I woke up at seven. I was like, I'm going back to sleep. And like, I just checked in Twitter and stuff like about nine o'clock. I went back to sleep, you know, and I didn't wake up till 12. Did you know at Kroger, shopping online with pickup and delivery is the same as shopping in store? Same low prices, same personalized deals, same rewards with no hidden fees or markups on your same family favorites, like honey crisp apples and pasta sauce. The only difference is you don't have to put on shoes. Start your cart today at croaker.com. Croaker, fresh for everyone. Restrictions apply, see site for details. And now I'm way behind, you know, like I'm sure we're going to ask you one more question. I don't want to ask, I have quite a few questions, all right. So when we're going to have today, actually, I'm going to show Reeve, the co-founder of Twitter. And I know that you have some dilemma on Twitter. If there are a few questions, no more than three questions, you want to ask to ask them. Okay, the number one question I would ask is, are you solving? Are you solving? Let's write this down. Okay, okay, I got it because the idea is, no, look, I have not came out against Heather. You were, you were in Bahamas, you were outside of the bank. Delta bank, who's their banking partner? Break it down to us. What happened when you went to Bahamas? Well, let me give you three questions first. Okay. I want to, I want to honor your three questions, sure. Number one, are you solving? Number two, what is your relationship with Delta bank? And number three, have you always been solvent? That's a big difference. Are you solving now? Have you always been solvent? My opinion about Tether is that, just give you the 30,000-foot view. The way Tether was built was extremely criminal and extremely bad, but they're solvent now and they have all the money and they've faked it until they made it. I don't think Tether is in danger of going under. That's why I see people, most of the people who are talking about Tether exposed or it's going to unpack, like they're not really crypto people. I hear a lot of mainstream people talking about this because like, it's fear that's been put in people's heads. Whether or not they always have the money, I don't know, but I do believe Tether does have the money. Now, that may come out to be untrue. We're investigating it right now. We're going to get down to the bottom of it, but it's just like a lot of the major companies in crypto. I would say with the exception of Coinbase, Coinbase does not fit this, is that a lot of them did what Sam did, a lot of them do what Alamena did, but they're too big to fail now. And I think that does give stability to them. Are they figured in FTX? Tether? Yeah, well, Tether is, well, yeah, yeah, because Tether is $65 billion. But too big to fail, the concept, too big to fail, assumes there's a bailout at a certain point because it would impact a group of people so large that government couldn't afford. So anybody who isn't guaranteed a bailout isn't insured. I just agree with that. I understand your point, your reason for why you're saying that. But for me, when you look at Tether and their $65 billion, it's more like in the beginning, they laundered a bunch of money, they hit a bunch of money, they have a ton of assets that we don't even know that they have, and they can use those assets if there were a bailout. Like, let's say they actually have an insolvency old $5 billion. They bail out themselves. They bail out themselves. Exactly. There's a lot of BitFinex and other company, there's been heavily hit by the CFTC, had to remove America's BitFinex and Tether's, BitFinex started Tether in a roundabout way. There's a lot of ties there, which went Brock Pierce and OmniBlock Chain and Tether, and some of that stuff. There was a big thing that happened back in, I wanna say it was 2014. I may not have that year correct, but basically to where they sent a ton, like hundreds of millions of dollars to auditors, some of that and the auditors stole all the money, and then they had to come out and say, well, we don't actually have one-to-one backing of US dollars, but we have assets. I believe personally, Tether has enough assets to back up everything they have. They may have, if it ever happened, if there was a bank run on Tether, which you're getting into a circular problem of why there would need to be a bank run on Tether, like your Alameda was the number one holder of Tether. They had like 18% of it or something crazy, and maybe it was 12%, some crazy number. But what's their motivation to go bank run on Tether, knowing that if they pulled that much out and make the whole thing collapse? It's kind of like what, so if Elon Musk went and took all of his shares tomorrow, Tesla, what happens? It's kind of the same thing. So I'm not gonna name names. I'm gonna say I do not believe Coinbase as one of these companies. I think Coinbase started in the United States. I think when you lose them, XR Ripple, I don't think Ripple is one of these companies. It's totally different kind of structure than the exchange. But you're saying some were built more ethically than others? Yes. A lot of your US companies were built much more ethically than a lot of the ones that were overseas. That doesn't mean the overseas ones are in trouble. That doesn't mean they're ever gonna be in trouble, but it does mean that in the beginning of crypto, there were a lot of bad actors and a lot of bad players and a lot of this was built in a very sketchy way. But today I don't think it has gigantic effects. Now, that's the three questions. Moving back to your question about going to Deltech Bank. Was that what you asked about what happened there? Now just tell us because we understand you went there and you tell us your experience going over there. Yeah, so we certainly went over to the Bahamas for Sam. But let's specifically talk about Deltech Bank. Okay, so what they're telling us now. Okay, so now I now know the latest update on this, which is good. I told you I was behind it, no? I've known that was there since this morning. I haven't been able to check it. So basically we went to the Bahamas to pursue sand, to pursue FTX, and to pursue, I'm like, I don't wanna go beat him up or something. I'm peeling him down there, bounty hunting, trying to hog time, which didn't earn my mind, but something I knew wasn't gonna play well. I don't wanna turn him into the victim. But that's the whole thing. There's a very thin line that I walk between being aggressive and making sure I'm standing up for the people and that we're not becoming bullies that are going after people that don't need to be gone after. We're going after, we're bullying the bullies is what we're really doing. And so I went down there to get answers from him. And I wanted to go down there and give him a platform to be able to speak and answer hard questions. Eventually if he doesn't talk, I'm gonna show all the screenshots. People are gonna see the kind of questions that... So green shots from who? From Sam. Oh, from, okay, you're right. Sam, if texted back and forth, yeah. He's agreed to do a Twitter space with me, but didn't he agree to do it with somebody else? And now it's, so we'll see. I think he's placating just to... Well, I'm the only person that can help him. I'm the only person that can help Sam. Nobody else knows what I know. Well, people on my team know what I know. These people that are running these Twitter spaces, I just started this morning. It's kind of like watching somebody on a blindfold describe a painting they've never seen. That's what it is. I don't have a blindfold. I can tell you what the painting looks like. It's gotta be done in a methodical way because what am I gonna do? I'll give all the information to Gary Gensler so he can shred it because he was meeting with him for six months. But I know a lot, I believe I know more about what was going on in Alameda and FTX than even Sam himself knows. I think this thing goes up much higher. We know a lot of the inner day operations. We know a lot of the players. And I'm pretty sure I've got the entire architecture and structure down of the team of people that knew and did not know. We're still answering. We're gonna be asking questions to some of these people. These are what I say. We're going to these people's door. I'm gonna knock on these people's door and sit there until somebody comes out and tells me the answer is what we're looking for. Or at least comes out and says, I'm not going to tell you what you're looking for. Because there you go. We know why you're not seeing anything. Come send your lawyer out to talk to me. Whatever it is. So you get over there. You went after Sam, but then something else has been that related to FTX. So one of the things that we wanted to do, I know I came to one so many rabbit trails of this. We could really have a 47 hour podcast. I realize that. Yeah. Well, we had Dr. Mary Film Crew with us. So people are gonna see everything eventually. But so next time you're Miami, we'll be a little more sick. The 47 hour podcast. I don't need a Red Bull. Okay. So anyways, the point is, is one of the things we want to do while we're down there is go talk to Tether. And once we get down there and we start asking the questions, like, okay, well, Tether's down there, but really Dell Tech Bank is who we need to talk to. They're the key connecting everything. Because they were the partner for FTX. They were the banking partner for Alameda and had a partnership with FTX. Technically, I do not believe they were the official banking. It's source for FTX. I think that they were. We just haven't been able to find that and confirm it. But they also were the bank for Tether. And so we're like, let's go talk to the Tether people. Well, it was a weekend and we're like, probably nobody's gonna be there or whatever. We started investigating and we're like, Dell Tech Bank is where we need to go. So we went to Dell Tech Bank. It was a very scary. It was very scary. Because we blow out the Dell Tech Bank. There's nothing in there. Not a single thing. Concrete floors, everything's been ripped off the wall. We start looking in the window. It's gone. It's not there. We go back. There's a security guard. I wish we would have went through the door. And silly question. But you're sure you're at the right spot. 100%. Yeah. This would make sense in a few seconds. If I ever get to my point. So we go out back and we're looking out back. Security guard comes to us. Oh, no, they moved. Like, okay, cool. They moved. Okay, that's great. So then they take us to a door that shows us where the address where they went is. It's across the street. Cool. It's across the street. Now, I will say when you look at that bank. When you are, when you go on the inside of that bank. And. I look, I can't tell you one way or the other, but I can tell you that. I definitely 100% know everything that was inside of that bank. I may know someone that walked inside and took a look around. But maybe found some evidence actually inside of there. But what I will tell you is. It's not being refurbished. It's not actively refurbished. And we know we went there on Monday. It's well Monday, work day. Nothing's going on there. There's a security guard out out back. They just sit there. No employees. No, there's nobody. There's one security guard there. No employees. It's. That's the new address. No, this is this is the old address. Okay. Okay. So, so it's the thing on the side says it's being refurbished. It's not being refurbished. It's not being refurbished. It's been broken down. And it's sitting there. We go to the bank on Sunday. I just get to say sometimes you have to wait for permits. Nothing happens for a while. And then you start. That's why you might not have seen any kind of work. Fair. Fair. It's not actively being refurbished as we speak. I would like to get the timeline to find out when it started that. I know that there. I know for 100% sure that people were in that building in 2013 is one thing I will say. But people find out more about what that means probably in a couple of weeks. But we went to the new bank and they're security guard the new bank. And security guard, we go home back. It's a Sunday. We make a video out there. You know, like check out here. I am a delta bank, you know, whatever. And our narrative. When we went like what we wanted to uncover is there's nothing done cover. That's what we were hoping. Like because when I put up that bank, there was nothing in the windows. I was scared. I was like, what have we uncovered here? If that has been refurbished, is it going to another place? Good. We want tether to be okay. We don't want tether to be a scam. We don't want delta bank to be a scam. That's bad for crypto. Like we hope regardless of how it was built. That it's in good standing now, right? So we go and talk to security guard and say this delta bank. Yeah, man. Delta, you know, Catherine Bahamas. Where he said, they're on the fifth floor. Like, okay, can we go away? He said, not this weekend. Sometimes they come in on the weekend. Sometimes they don't. But it's on the weekend. Like, there's nobody there. It's okay. What time they get here in the morning? Is that about eight o'clock again in the morning? Is it okay? Cool. We'll be back tomorrow. So I make a little video talking about like, hey guys, like actually we were there. We were kind of scared that, you know, there was, you know, there was nothing there. We're over here. They're telling us there's people to work there. It's that 10 people go in there every day, whatever the case. And so we show up the next day. So next day we go in there. We meant to get there at eight, but we ended up having to change our flight. And so we got there about 930. Get there at 930. The moment we pull on the property, there's a security guard out there just looking at us smiling. Yeah, this look on its face like he did. They're waiting on us. Also, somebody told me that that security guard. Now, I don't know this would be true. Someone told me they work in the building. And that they, they don't usually have security there. They literally went and got a security guard to sit outside and wait for us. We show up immediately as we pull on. He's smiling telling us to go telling us to go. Well, we don't take no for an answer. So we parked anyways and got out. And so what's going on? He said, yeah, they said they don't want to talk to you. You're allowed to be here. I said, oh, we're not allowed to be here. He said, yeah, I said, what? Tell them to come talk to all we want is we want them to come talk to us. That's it. Just come talk. Like we want your story to be good. Like we're not coming to attack you. We actually want to come and get the answers. So that people know that you're okay. Like you should want to invite me up there and have this conversation and end this. Walk through the office. Okay. Good. Everything looks good. You know, 100%. 100%. So the guy kept saying it's prior property. Well, here's an interesting thing about the Bahamas. Let me tell you, we met so many great people from Bahamas. We never had one bad interaction with somebody that was from the Bahamas. Only bad interactions we had were with foreigners. Then we're not, you know, we're not Bahamas citizens or weren't natives. Okay. So even that security guard, even this security guard, he just had the Albany. They were smart. They were in support of what we were doing. They want this stuff to be uncovered. But they were just like, what can I do? Don't you think sometimes it happens where, look, when our journalist is coming in, we just do nothing to talk about. Don't put him. And especially when it comes down to you, you're very outspoken. Yeah. Some people might view as the Alex Jones. And I'm picking it for you. He just ended up over there. Don't make me take my shirt off here. No, no, no. No, no. Listen to you. I understand you genuinely want to find good, right? Yeah. But then some other people might see the round. Like listen, I don't want to, I don't want to mean. I'm busy. And that may be a lot more simple as an explanation than just building a hole. Because that's what happened, right? They just didn't let you in, right? Or we ended up. They were running. Oh, there's more. No, we're going to get to more. Okay. So let's go. And I'm totally good. I'm totally good with people like not wanting to talk to me, but I'm going to come metaphorically kick your door in and throw a digital sledgehammer through your window. And you're going to talk to me. All right. You know, you don't have a choice. Yeah. Come out and talk to me. Or else we are going to throw you under the bus so hard that you're not going to be able to get back up. Because it's time we get the answers. The mainstream media. They're pussies. And we're not. And we're going to come get the information because the people deserve it. You can't have a bank with $65 billion from one company and not have accountability. That's over. Like we're in a new day in a new time and I really hope people are starting to grasp and understand this. So yeah, Deltech, if you don't want to come talk to me, that's great. You want to talk about your bank secrecy act, which is in the Bahamas. I know you don't care about any of that stuff. We're going to get it one way or the other. So your best option is to come out and give it to us freely. You're going to come off a lot better. And so I'll talk about what they said in the email just now here in a moment. But basically they come and they kick us out of the property. Well, once again, remember, nobody in the Bahamas. Everyone in the Bahamas wants us to get these stories. Everybody in the Bahamas that they don't want to arrest us. So we go stand right on the property line. And guess what? Nobody coming to the security guard just stands on a property line. We're on a Twitter spaces, we're YouTube live streaming, we're yelling, we're pointing up. The guy in the window of the deltack for looks down and flicks us off. Did you know by the way that deltack paint was started by the guy who created his vector gadget? Wait, so he chose someone who's a show? Yes, you can't make this stuff. We're not going to get it. It was the point is. In that crazy. But anyways, this is how professional this company is. Is they literally have 10 employees according to what we heard. And one of them is up in the window flicking us off. Can you imagine if your bank of America teller did that? Yeah, they probably fired. They'd be fired immediately, right? Yeah. It doesn't matter if you don't want to talk to the press, but don't make us look that bad. Expect the bank that bucks. It's 60 billions of dollars. A little bit more professional, yes. You are now starting to see this, right? So we sit there and we're live streaming. And so they're not coming out where there are people coming out that are wanting to talk to us. We can't really tell you much right now, but just know we really support you being here. People that work in the building on the other floors. Other floors have been on the other floors. Okay. So finally, we say, okay, all right, that's fine. We're going to walk back to the bank. We're going to walk back over to the other bank. Because this right across the street. I said, because basically it's this. Hey, guys, they say this bank's being reaffirmed. Let's go show you what's going on over this one. And then we'll be back over there. We're not leaving till we get this stuff. So it was amazing. As soon as we walk to the other bank. Here comes a white SUV with people from the bank want to talk to us. They didn't want us to show what was in that bank. Oh, uh-huh. Once again, I think we look at how long it's being refurbished. And I will tell those people I have evidence. I have things that we found literal documents that you left laying around at the bank. We have that. And we have multiple copies of it too. So if they want to come after me, that's fine. I don't want to have to come out. It's going to still come out. Come shoot me. It's still going to come out. Okay. So we have stuff that they don't even know that we have that is potentially condemning. Now, we're still going through a lot of that stuff. And going through phone numbers and meetings and times and dates. So I'm not going to tell you right now I've got a smoking gun on it. But I'm telling you, we got a lot of evidence. But the whole take away is that a lot of the infrastructure supporting crypto is bush leagues at best. Oh, yeah. For amateur amateur amateur. It's amateur hour all the way around. Yeah. No, don't have banks around since 1987. It's not it's not a brand new bank that just popped up overnight, right? And people are looking at that farming to the moonstone bank that's up in in Washington, which we're also probably going to go to as well and get answers there. But so what happens is the lady comes out and talks to she's a very nice lady, right? I think her hands are tied. I think I am actually going to be talking to somebody who had a direct interaction with her on the phone. Probably when I leave here, the representatives that came out from the bank. Yeah. Her name was, I think, Janay. Is her name? She asked not to be on camera. We turn the cameras off and talk. And we said, OK. And so we asked her. We said, OK, what do we need to say? Well, give us some written questions. And we will get get back to you. I said, well, you know, that's fine. And we'll give you a written question. We're coming to get an interview. Like it be who's you to let us come up and do this on the fifth floor and clear this up. And said, OK, we'll see what we can do. We'll talk to them. They respond to us the next day and said, well, you know, like we can't answer a lot of these questions because of bank secrets. Yeah. And, you know, I don't know if they think we're not coming back. Like they tried to just push us off. Is what they tried to do. So, right now, what did they send you? Well, so we asked them, OK, we'll come back on Friday. And so they said, well, you know, the best we can do is written answers to some of your questions. OK, that's fine. So that's what they just said. That's what they just respond and said. Like, yeah, we're not going to be conducting in person. That's fine. We're bringing protesters. We're going to bring a whole army of people that FTX is screwed. And we're going to stand right on your property line until you come out. So this is all of this. This is not not related to to terror. No, what? Alameda and FTX are the banking partner of Deltech. It's all tight. It's all tied together because one of the things that came out while we were there, Lincoln Bain. So Lincoln Bain is a guy that is an activist politician there in the Bahamas. Almost every... We talked about... We asked probably 20 people from Bahamas, what their opinion of him was. 18 of them, over the moon, love the guy. I told him it's more of a weird text. I said, we fight the same fight. You know, we're fighting the same kind of thing. One person was like, all politicians are cropped. And then one person who worked for the bank was like... I wonder why, you know? So we go and we have a live stream with him. And he's showing his documents. He's got all kinds of stuff that people... Like we broke the story that FTX and Alameda were basically laundering money through the real estate. So on October 19th... Now we don't even have all of the listings for this company. And they're so... They're so sloppy. They're all so freaking bushly. It's unbelievable. If you're going to launder money through... No, I've never laundered money, okay? But I'm just saying, if I were to launder money, and I were to do it through real estate, and the name of my company was FTX Digital Markets, and also Alameda Research. If those were the names of my company, and I wanted to create a shell company in order to launder money through real estate, do you think I should call it FTX property holdings and Alameda property holdings? That would be a good idea. That would be... This way you remember, yeah. This way is definitely tied together. So somewhere in the recent... In the last year, I don't have a date on this, they created FTX property holdings, and they started buying real estate through that. Well, now... You do it when you don't think you're going to get caught. Right. You do this when you think I'm outside. Oh, there's so much reason why they didn't think they were caught. Yeah. Yeah. What do they do with it? They were... I mean, part of these customer funds, they were taking out and putting in real estate in the Bahamas. That's what they're doing. There's so far they're showing off that there's about $900 million worth of property. $72 million, Well, the pin house was $30 million. The mom's house is $16 million. It's an old Ford Bay that's another gated community somewhere in Albany. Those two are actually in Sam's name and his parents' names. All the other ones are in FTX property holdings. There's a total of about $138.5 million of what we know for that one listing. On October 19th, three weeks before the insolvency, they created an additional company, Alameda property holdings. We don't even know everything they put up under that umbrella. That was... They created that company and were funneling money out like crazy. We think in the Bahamas alone, the number could be somewhere around $300 million. But we were also told they did this in Dubai too. They've got other places around the world for property that they were also doing this. So if that's the case... So then I have a question. I have a question. So if you look at reserve fractional banking or banks have money, but they only have to keep so much in reserve. That's over. They don't do that anymore. Did they not do that at all? No, fractional reserve banking got cut out during the pandemic in 2020. They don't have to... They took off completely. Oh, I didn't know that. Yeah, they're all... All the banks are in charge. It was 8% to call it the Basel. Yeah, yeah. The court were doing... But they're going to reinstating it now, little by little. There's like a low-desting... What they're trying to do. They're fantastic, right? Yeah. No, my point is, so they didn't have to keep all the money in the actual bank. So when you speak about... But this is not regulated. No, I know. Yeah. So then if FTX takes some money, it's... Well, laundering, not... It's embezzlement. Yeah, whatever. I'm not a lawyer, but... No, no, but the point is... Like, is there... Obviously, I want to ask this question, but I don't want to make it sound like it's obvious. So obviously, they shouldn't do that. Yeah. Obviously, they shouldn't do that. But legally... I don't know. There's 4% of people that said it was ugly. Legally, when they took the money, was that something that you were signing up for? Like, is there... Actually, well, great question. Great question. Fantastic question. Number one, with banks, they're all insolvent. That's why a bank run is called a bank run, because no fractures are a bank. If we all went to the bank today, man, I wish we could get people to do this. If I want to take $5,000 on my account and take to Las Vegas to play poker with, I've got to call a week ahead of time. I know. $5,000. Guys, that's not that much money. I know it might be a lot of money. You got to do today. Uh-huh. You can't get cash. They don't have cash. It's very hard to take cash out of like a lot of cash out of a bank. Sometimes if you want to take like $30,000 out, you've got to go to like two or three banks. Uh-huh. Yeah. Or they don't have it anymore. Or they don't let you. Yeah. Yeah. So, let's first make a distinction. This is why crypto exists. It's reaction of things like that. Yes. Right? It's not perfect yet. I believe we will get there to a better system using crypto in Bitcoin. But when it comes to what's happening in our banking world, this is why Alameda did this. They come from Jane Street training. They come from traditional market. They just try to bring into crypto what they're already doing in the banks. That's the biggest game of the whole thing. That's what all the banks are. Why do you think Goldman Sachs pays off Andrew Ross working to write flood pieces? The banks know what they do and they have to have good press all the time. So that's the first part of this. The second part of this is where you are discussing is this basically crime that customers know. With Celsius. Okay. Celsius was a lending platform and had an earn program. So when you put your money on there, you understood they were taking that money and they were leveraging it. Hopefully in a safe way. It wasn't a safe way. But hopefully in a safe way in order to earn you yield to earn the company yield and you got to percentage of that. Basically, the same exact thing that banks do. Right? Gemini. Gemini had an earn program as well. Well, Gemini's earn program was backed by Genesis. Genesis trading that's had a lot of problems. And now all the customers that were earning on that earn program their profits on their yield are locked up. Their actual money that they put in, they can still withdraw and is not gone. But the earn program piece is, right? When you sign up for those programs, you understand that's happening. When you sign up on an exchange to sit your money there for it to just sit, no, that's a crime. You cannot take customers' funds and do whatever you want to with it. Even though banks do that. Even though banks do. Yes, I know. Even though banks do, right? You're not allowed to do that. It's fraud. You're lying to your customers. Because what's the difference in taking the funds to buy pizza and taking the funds to invest in something if the people think their funds are there? This is what it creates. It creates a website that is zeroes and ones of what is in an account and it might as well be a Photoshop PDF. There's nothing backing it internally. And that's why everybody ends up in the situation is because they trusted FTX too much and they thought that everything was going to be okay and they thought their funds were safe. How do you know now if they're deregulated? And this was a centralized exchange, right? Yeah, of course. But still, if you are centralized, do you think they should be governed by, say, the US or something else if they're traded in the US? That's a great question. Okay. Or no matter what. These are things I love talking about. The only person that is worse than Sam Bankman-Freed. Now, look, there's a chance Sam Bankman-Freed has been played in all this and he's not actually as bad as we think he is. That's kind of some stuff we're uncovering is that there's an infrastructure behind him that's the mechanism for turning this wheel. And I think he actually may have been naive and a lot of it. Like I said, I think I know more about what's going on than he did, right? But when you look at what I lost my share of thought, what was it? I will remind you my question. Please. So if you are decentralized, you are decentralized. Okay, regular. But if you are centralized, don't you need to at least at that point. So the person that is more responsible than Sam Bankman-Freed, the person that's more responsible than any human that exists on Earth for people losing their money is Gary Gensler of the SEC chair. Okay. His job is to create clarity and regulation in the security space, which means in crypto, we don't have any basically. He has a responsibility to create that. Instead, he's got sidetracked with letter after letter after letter, going after person after person after person after person exchange after exchange after exchange, except for FTX, he'd meet with Sam, which we can get into the crazy things there as well, considering that Sam's girlfriend Caroline, who is a CEO of Alameda, her dad was Gary Gensler's direct boss at MIT. That's another story. But the fact here is Gary Gensler has had a dereliction of duty. He hasn't created any clarity. He's only done it through enforcement. I try to compare the SEC what it's about. But enforcement is settlements, which isn't clarity. Exactly. And even within that, even when the XRP case is over, the ripple case, there's going to be so many redactions. But now you're getting into the details of this. No, no, no, no, this is important. Okay. The reason is, no company will register in the United States now. No, because of Gary Gensler in the lack of clarity, Coinbase and Jim, well, Jim and I got the license. Coinbase is kind of grandfathered in. Like I said, I think they have been a better actor in the most of the other actors in the space. Not perfect. But you're not going to get any exchange. It's going to come register here. Why would they register in a world where they have no idea what they're stepping into? Once again, it's like describing an art piece while you're blindfolded. Like what regulation is going to look like for these companies in the register? They have no idea. Assuming you was doing it right, assuming next person after him will do it right, do you think philosophically an exchange, a centralized exchange, should be regulated properly? Absolutely. Absolutely. But we're still at a fundamental misunderstanding of so many pieces about crypto, where there are not people in place that can make those decisions well right now. And if those decisions are made too early, it's going to stifle innovation. And if they're made too late, it's going to crush retail sentiment and confidence, right? So we have a bill right now and we're supposed to get it hopefully funded. We've been talking about getting funds. It's hard to raise money in a bear market. It's $3.5 million what we're raising for it. But our bill is a mechanism to create crypto regulation. We're not like Sam trying to tell people what we think should happen. We're trying to create kind of like a body that makes those decisions that has crypto representation. A body that can actually make these decisions in an informed way. Not just like Elizabeth Warren reactionary like, environment's bad. So let's ban Bitcoin. You know, like, you know, or Bitcoin made that are educated that are knowledgeable that are. Yeah, okay. Yeah, that we need people that fit the philosophies of crypto represented there too, right? Like obviously you're going to have to have like good cops, bad cops, people in the middle people from different expertise. But we've got to have some of the people that wrap up the ideals of what crypto is started as to keep the integrity of it. So because of all that, you know, we don't have the regulation in place to be able to invite people to come here. Yes, centralized exchanges. If it's not obvious, centralized exchanges need regulation. Sam was trying to destroy DeFi and decentralization, which is so ironic. Because there's never been a bigger walking billboard for, you know, or neon light for decentralization. What we've just gone through 100%. Yeah. Okay. So question number two. 49 question. Okay, here we go. How do we, how do we stop all this from happening again? Yeah. So, you know, what's the, so we have Coinbase, which is regulated centralized. And that's they're acting well. They're, you know, they're doing a good job. But nobody really, many people didn't see FTX coming. Right. So what's the lesson that we have to take into the future? You're sort of pushing tether now. I can see this is like a thread you're following. Oh, yeah. There's so much more. We're just, I know. So I see it. All the companies that have either come to the point right now where maybe they are acting properly now. Yeah. Maybe they didn't get there. Okay. So whatever. You can expose some things, but ultimately they're not going to change their ways. They can't change your history. But going forward. Yes. How do we do things right? Yeah. The important thing is going forward. Because like, look, do I want to see people throwing in a jail over this FTX situation? Yeah. Absolutely. I want to see people going to prison. I believe that there will be a fall guy. And, you know, there's a map for that that has been done with some other things similar to where I think I know who it's going to be. But I want to see people go to prison, but not because I want people to be punished. Like, I want people to go to prison to just prevent this from happening again. That's what I care about so much. Crypto was born out of libertarian ideals, right? I certainly ascribe to a lot of those ideals. People probably know which side of politics I'm on, like in general. But when it comes to like libertarian values, almost everybody that really is deeply interested in crypto share some of those. Freedom. Freedom and financial privacy, you know, sovereignty of your own money. Like, those are things that we care about. And we want to return the space to that. Now, your Bitcoin maximalist will tell you, Bitcoin is the only way there. I'm more realistic in terms of, I do believe Bitcoin does eventually become the world's our currency. But I think it's 25 to the years down the road. It's a long battle before then. And we've got to all work together on all fronts to try to get it to where it needs to be, right? We have got to work together on all fronts to try to get it to where it needs to be, right? We have got to stop looking at our portfolios and saying it is great for BlackRock to come into crypto. It is great for the Wall Street to come into crypto. It's not. It's not great for these people to come into crypto because they wanted to destroy it from the inside. And I said this last year, like the way institutions and banks wanted to destroy crypto is from the inside out. It's not from the outside in. They can't touch it from the outside. It's like even if they're laws against DeFi, even they come out with laws against decentralization, you can still do it. You still do it. You still do it. It's like living in China, like you got a digital fence there. You can't get around stuff. Use of VPN. Eventually when the community is big enough, any politician looks at the demographic and tell himself, look, if I'm going to go against decentralized, I am not going to get elected again. Therefore, I have to support whatever it is. So it's just a matter of kind of like get big or die in that size of the community. Otherwise, it's not going to. But crypto is too big already. Yeah, I agree. I agree. I think that especially in certain areas, if you're in a West Coast or so on, it's a little bit more. I feel like people are going to have hard time going and getting elected. I agree. And I can tell you, because I'm very plugged into this political world, what you said is 100% accurate. The Democrats have came out against crypto. They're recanting that. There is now a move to the next Democratic presidential candidate will be pro crypto. It's not who you think it's going to be. There's already a movement. I don't know if anybody can understand this. Joe Biden's not going to be the next president. The Democrats have already chosen who it's going to be. And this person is pro crypto. They are looking. How do you say that was such like authority? Because I know the lobbyists. I know the politicians. I know the Democratic Party. Who is the person? Well, I can't give you. Oh, you want me to tell you who the person is? Yeah. It's Gavin Newsom. Well, he already announced that he's not going to go against Biden. We'll see. We'll see. We'll see. That's not a super curious. That's not a popular sentiment right now, right? Like, why when midterm elections are going on, he's going to come out and say he's not going to do it. Basically, there is a group of Democratic lobbyists or committee. Whatever. I'm just getting new to this world. But basically, they choose who the presidential candidate is. Why do you think Bernie Sanders didn't have a chance? He was always chosen to be the person. They don't like Joe Biden anymore. They've turned south on him. He makes them look bad. They don't think you win the next election. Gavin Newsom is going to end up. We'll see. To quote this. A screenshot it. You know, remind me, Tweet, in two years. All right. Absolutely. You touched that part. Do you think the election were reaked in 2020? Well, I can't get canceled on Twitter anymore. Thanks, Elon Musk. I could say whatever. No. Look, look. They can cancel Tweet on Apple. That can happen. I've been saying that's a very scary thing. Here's what I'll tell you about elections. We have to move them to blockchain. But it's not there yet. Once things get moved to blockchain in a way that is smart. And it is done where literally fraud will not be possible in that. We're going to be a much better place. I don't know if you guys. That's why they wouldn't let it go to blockchain if they did rig the election. Why would they? Because they can't keep rigging it and getting away with it. I'm not saying they did rig it. Okay, I'm just saying if they did rig it. So you don't you don't think so. I believe sure they did not. I believe the election. I'm so careful what I say here. I believe that when it comes to the elections. At minimum. Yeah. The pandemic was used in a way to favor one party heavily. Okay. That's it minimum. Now at maximum you're going to conspiracy. People are not ball box. Whatever. To me, that's not really what's that important. Because you know, leveraging fear for new cycles and eventually a vote is a pretty big deal. And that's pretty obvious. We don't want to be suppressed on our views in this podcast. Let's continue. We don't know. We don't know. That's what I'm saying. I don't know. And I will tell you that I have talked to people that are heavily on the inside of that. That I do trust that say that the idea that it was completely rigged is way overstated and not closed. To reality. But obviously there are some things that were used in minimum. Now I'm not saying that people are correct. You know, it's fucking annoying. You do have a self-preservation. I like that. No, now I understand. People think I just far off the hip. I'm very. I'm much more calculated with the things I said. That's good. No, you're smart, dude. But it's annoying when you look at the news. Like just thinking about leveraging fear and new cycle to achieve a result versus lack of coverage for something that's an actual issue. Yeah. That's what's that's really fucking annoying. Yeah. Like you think about how many like scare articles about COVID and yeah, okay, people are stressed out. But like you can't tell me that news didn't push that fear and ingrain that fear in people by showing them every single day. New strains, new this, new that. Nothing's working more people dying. Like, but then nothing crickets on. Yeah. But it's great. But it's great. It's great. But once again, because this has led them to having zero credibility. Yeah. The future of media is YouTube. Rumble. Twitter. In my country, for instance, media. Which country is that? Israel. Israel, okay. I'm from Israel. So the media was for many years. I mean, what you see over here in America, we've had this. I mean, now it's much more polarizing. America today is not what it used to be when you look at Democrats versus Republicans. It's all about the extremists on both sides. It's not really what it used to be in the 80s. What you see today, it's what we've seen in Israel. I want to say in the 90s. And then it turned back to a point that things start changing. Yeah. Now you had some alternative. We have alternative channels before the internet provided us. It's like, we've seen that before and it goes back in a circle. Yeah. And I think that's the important thing to talk about the elections too. I'm not very back to that. But it's very insane. Like, people think at this point, like, well, you know, no point in voting. Democrats are going to win. They're going to win everything forever because the system is set up. That's not the way politics work. It always swings back and forth. It always swings. And so with the media, I think the media said a point where it can't swing because we're in a new age of news delivery, right? Fox News, CNN, Newsmax, CNBC, MSNBC, whatever you want to look at there. Like, they're just not going to be the delivery channel for newer times. Well, they're not the delivery news. It's like reporting. Like you said, reporting, whatever, 2.03 point. Yeah. It's like, we already figured out like content, consumption, distribution. That's already migrated social. So now it's, I love it. Like citizen journalism. Yeah. I like, I like taking lines from other people. Someone said, how do you know if a news channel is bias? Well, say you look at CNN and Fox News. Fox News said nothing positive about Obama. Only negative and look at CNN. Everything was negative about Trump. Nothing positive. That's how you know that they're cooking your brain. They're not trying to give you any twin formation. They're manufacturing it. And that's how you know they're not. And that's where people start looking outside. Some people aren't. Yeah. Well, they're all alone by the same people. I mean, BlackRock and Vanguard are the top holders in a most every media company. Oh, wow. Yeah. So one of their biggest, you know, one of their biggest holdings, the company on CNBC, you know, which is financial channel. No, I will say to be fair, I've had mostly good interactions with CNBC. So I'm not going to throw them under the bus. To me, that's what's important is my personal relationship with some of these companies. And how they treat me. CNBC came out to do a hit piece on me at my office. They came out of my studio and filmed a video that was very obvious when we were answering questions. They tried to okey-doke me. I have a bankruptcy in my past. So when I was 21, when I was in the middle of my addiction, I filed a bankruptcy. I was gambling. I was shocker probably. Like I like to take gambles. Like I was big gambling online, losing money, all kinds of stuff. And like one of the questions that got asked during this interview was like, so you filed for bankruptcy. And I was like, yeah, we already talked about the addiction stuff. I was in the bottom of my life. Yeah, obviously, but they tried to okey-doke me with a question. Nobody has ever even heard that before. It never even made public. So maybe I'm announcing right now I had a bankruptcy. I was 21. Which is not even a, it's not a big deal. It's not a big deal. Right? But it's like the round of questioning on coins we talked about and stuff is like, oh no. But I think they came to my office and they talked to my employees and they looked around. They were like, this isn't the guy that people think that he is. And so they actually came out that it wasn't a bad piece on me. It was fair. I just care about being fair. Like certainly people can ask questions and criticize me. But just be fair. My experience with CNBC has been, they've been very fair to me. And I will take that. Yeah. That's why I like podcasts. Yeah. And I will definitely do that. I will definitely do that. God forbid. But I will definitely do that. What about the part where I told him to come kill me? Who are you going to do that? No. The thing is, the thing is with our podcast, we have one thing we want to come out smarter. Every time we talk to someone. Yeah. And I'm definitely enjoying this because I am learning. And being smarter means you cross some boundaries in terms of trending, very emotional shit that people are dealing with. Yeah. That alcohol was supposed to make you say everything. But you're already open. I don't need it. I told you I have no idea. I don't need it. I have no idea. All right. What do we, what do we not do? I mean, I don't want to do like the whole like go through coins and shit because that's really cheap. I'm going to ask you something though. Some of them are even cheaper right now. I have a question. Can I ask one more question? Sure. Sure good. Why were you getting yelled at yesterday? Oh. Well, look, there's, there is a thread on Twitter. This guy's at KXBT. He's like, you know, kind of like, he's like a less good journalist than me. Sorry, Zach. But, you know, the point is like he's a guy that was exposing stuff and has been exposed. He's done a lot of good stuff in the space. Him and Coffee Silla are two guys that have really done a lot of good stuff. They busted off a lot of good scams and things like that. However, to be able to keep up their, you know, what they do, like sometimes they give incomplete information or sometimes I think they talk, like Coffee Silla has always been fair to me. Coffee Silla has always talked to me and asked me questions before he put something out about me. And he hasn't really put out terrible stuff about me out there. Zach never did. Zach would just like to go and attack me for stuff. And he hasn't attacked me much over the last year because there's not a lot to attack. So we put out this very famous Twitter thread about me last January or in January about a year ago. That was about projects that I covered. About half of it was factually incorrect. He had a, like one thing he said, we covered a coin that rug pulled and blah, blah, blah. No, they just rebranded and it's a different ticker. Like the project's still there, the website's still up. It still works. They rebranded. So you didn't actually do the full research on that. You just saw a coin and you stopped there and said, oh, it was a scam. But it actually wasn't some of the projects you brought up in there. Yeah, they turned out to be scams. I didn't know they were scams. Oh, this was back to what we're talking about before. Back when we were talking about before. And this woman that the conference was going off on you off that same thread. That's what when CMBC came to our office. That's what they wanted to dig into is that thread over and over and over again. We get to go. I did a 160 tweet response to that that exists on Twitter. I didn't want to know exactly my response to every single thing, every single one of those accusations. They go back and look. But at the end of the day, there is no. I have remorse for mistakes that I made for sure. And I've owned that. No person in crypto has owned their mistakes more than me. And so we had not done a sponsor video in a year. And we'll never do a coin or token promotion video again. So she came on. She tried to rush the stage where they, you know, stopped her from. But basically all she wanted to do was talk about how bad of a person that I was based on this Twitter thread that she actually had no knowledge or evidence or cell phone. She was just reading tweets. And so I made the point like, you know, this lady's a child molester. Why can I not say that? Because you can just all you have to say is you're a scammer. You did this. You just, you have no evidence. If you spent a day with me, you would understand how dramatically untrue what you're saying is. But yet you're still saying it because you're part of an angry mob on Twitter that just likes to regurgitate other things that you see. And that stuff comes out of conferences. And that stuff comes out of conferences. And so she was attacking me over the same thread that people attacking for a year on. We, after that thread, we said, you know what? Like we do feel like we made some mistakes. Let's stop doing sponsored videos completely. We gave 100% of our YouTube money away for this year to our, our, one of our NFT projects that, that, that we have. So like, we pull back so far from that and we listen. And we're like, you're right. The stuff doesn't look good. Like, and it's less than 1% of my content, the sponsored. But I make a, I make five videos a day. It's still a lot of content. And so we really took that thread and looked at ourselves in the mirror and said, how can we be better at what, what can we do? Because we're not bad people and we do care. And we don't want people to lose money. Like it kills me when people lose money. Now, when people buy it at the top and they lose, that doesn't kill me. Because I know if they stick with us that they'll get the money back down the road. And that's just a market cycle thing. But she was just yelling about all this stuff she didn't know about. She, she would say like, you didn't talk to Sam Bangman for it. Well, I can show you all the text after we get off. I can show you the text that he sent me and how when I asked him to unblock me, you can go time check that he unblocked me. And it's just people that are just vitriolic and angry. Yeah. And one of the things, this is what got sent to me when I asked. Which question is that? 100%. 100%. Yeah. So now, now, why do you think it happens that someone like you that has a big cold follower goes and promotes something in a certain, I mean, it was a specific one, I guess. But say take Gary Vee, he was talking about specific projects. He was specifically talking about the NFT market and how you're going to make eventually your invoicing NFT and so on. But then today he goes and say, keep your money. Don't spend it on anything. And people still idolize him. Yeah. There's no negative chatter anywhere to find. It's not that different. Why is it that one person get all this map gang and then another person staying at the top of the food chain as some sort of a profit? Yeah. That's a great question. But look, Gary Vee certainly gets a lot of criticism. I've seen a lot of criticism for Gary Vee. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I've definitely seen a lot of criticism for him. I don't dislike him. He's not like my cup of tea. My business partner loves him. My business partner actually has like some shoes. And by the way, we have nothing against. Yeah, I don't have anything. Yeah. He has some shoes signed by him and all this stuff. And you know, it's whatever. But I think in crypto, like we do have a big problem with propaganda and bot armies. Like I said, we're going to be doing a big expose on this on the Solana slash FTX slash Alameda bot army and propaganda army that exists out there. It's real and it's provable. Once again, 94 to 96% of people agree with us on our opinion on Sam. If you go look at the comments, it's like 60, 40 or 70, 30. Like the numbers are way out of whack there. And there's a it's so easy to tell this stuff. So I think Gary Vee does get criticized, but he is not only in a financial world. I'm only in the financial world in crypto. But I do want to say, like just one last point about the lady that heckled me. This is what's so funny about this whole thing, right? One of the big things that people out put out about me is I had a media sheet. Everybody who does sponsored anything in the world of influencers. I have a media sheet. Everyone has a media sheet, right? Well, we charged $30,000 for a video. Now, one of the reasons was because we want to weed out bad projects. We only want projects that could afford that because that way we don't get garbage. And I didn't even like doing them. About the last year that we were doing those, I really hated doing sponsored videos. And I didn't want to do them. So we set our prices up really high. Val, you still was probably about that. And we were not the most expensive people out there. I guarantee you 30,000 is not the cheapest. Yes, not even close. Not even close. Not the most expensive, you mean? Not the most expensive. Not the most expensive. Yeah, sorry, yeah. Yeah, sure, sure, sure. Right, you can pay. You could pay $100,000 for an ad. I think Tim Ferriss on his podcast. It's like 50k for a 30-second mineral. Like, this is business. Yeah. This is business. And people don't really understand that. Let me ask you, were you, when you sponsored, did you say this is sponsored? For sure. Okay. This is my question. This is my question. If I go and I declare, it's not like there's a project. Listen, I'm giving you this coins. You give me a dollar for those coins before anybody buys. Okay, now you have a piece of it. So you're technically a nut sponsoring. And now let's push it. You literally go and you explain this is sponsored. Mm-hmm. Take it the way it is. And now let me tell you what it is. They paid me to say something. Now I'm saying it. And you understand that. From that point on, nobody can go and blame. The only problem would come down where you were not clear. Mm-hmm. Or you continue to support a scam person because it's a friend. And they put you, yeah, that is the problem that can come. Once you know, it's a sponsorship. So people sit on you because you charged. Yeah, it's just what's so funny. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So so funny is the lady that was heckling me. She owns an NFT project and she pays influencer promoter project. Ah. Okay. Pot calling the kettle black. 100%. I said that on stage. You know, so I probably could have handled that a little more. My emotional response could have probably been a little better. But most people that watched it and understood what happened. They said I literally, you know, destroyed her from the ground up. So. I just, it's just so wild. Like people, like, because Gary Vee has 10 times the audience you have candidly. And I don't see people yelling at him at his conferences. Yeah. It's just like such an emotional, like it's like finance. Plus. I don't know. Because I don't think he did finance. The point is I don't think he did anything wrong. He said what he thought and what he believed in. Yeah. And then things turn and he's saying what he believes in now. Yeah. And my point behind this is this. And then it's no different than you. Okay. And you people also don't like to take responsibility. 100%. Yeah. I do. Like that's a big difference between me and a lot of other people. I take responsibility for everything I've done. But a lot of the audience, they don't want to take responsibility for their own actions and unoptions. Like when we look at these coins that we covered that were highly speculative. Number one, almost every coin we ever covered did well. It's just you go into a bear market and then everything plunges down. It's like, yeah, this coin is down 97%. But the two months after we covered it, it was up 400%. Or maybe it was up 30%. Like if you didn't take profits, like, that's your fault, you know. It's really dependent a lot on the cycle and what happens with prices going up. As long as they didn't use FTX and not have a stock. So you know what? That's that point. If I go and I put a dollar into coins, right? When is it the point for you to say I'm taking profits? Is it? Is that that's kind of like a question that was asked with Grand Cardone? He asked your investment. He was asking Kevin O'Leary and Kevin O'Leary give a vague answer. Because he wants to steal your money. Well, I mean, the idea for me was that if you're going to take, if you made a dollar, when do you get your dollar back with some interest and leave the rest? And what's the formula? Yeah, it's 7.2% in 37 days. No, no, no, I'm serious. If you have right now, if you haven't, you know a project. Well, if you put a dollar, you have five dollars. Do you take your dollar and a half out and leave the rest? How would you do it? It's market cycle dependent. So in crypto, we have a very strong roadmap for how the market moves. We've been saying since April, well, really the first week in May, we put out the video. We made the video in April. We believe the bottom of Bitcoin should be in between November 28th and December 15th. Give or take a couple weeks on either end. Everybody thought we were crazy. They said, oh, we bottomed in June. No, this is the market cycle. What happens? We generally know we thought Bitcoin was going to 100,000 in the last cycle and we got crushed because it didn't. But for two and a half years, I said the top of that market would be between Halloween and Thanksgiving. Hit exactly in that time frame. The time frames in crypto are so predictable that it's, you're, what you're doing and how much profit you're taking needs to be dependent on what part of that cycle you're in. If you're in the part of the cycle where things are generally going up parabolic, which is about a six-month period or so, you need to be taking the profits off the table all the time. If it's a bear market and you've invested in a project at $1 and it goes up to $1.04, when you take in exchange fees and off-ramping and capital gains, it's probably not worth it to pull that out for 4%. Probably better to let that sit and wait for a longer time period. But if you can generally within a two or three-month period take the majority of your profits and then when the bear market time within two or three months take the majority of your accumulating and then you're going to absolutely crush on this market. There's no exact formula. It's a game of trying to be mostly good. There is an ask you that because when you deal with day traders or people that run a portfolio, they'll tell you, well, they'll put the money in. If the stack goes down 50%, then I put another 50% to buy the stack on low cost average. Or if it goes up, this is where I start pulling money out. So they'll have already formulas that pretty much it's going to be a language that they would all speak. And that's why I wanted to see how you think about that. But that was just a real personal level. Well, crypto is different than the traditional markets. And we love the volatility. We hate when it goes down, but we love when it goes up. And the volatility is really what makes it so special in terms of speculation. And so look, if you're risk averse, you're just not going to do well in this market. If you've got big conace and you generally understand what you're investing in, generally understand the times to pull profits and accumulate, there's nothing like this in the entire world where he can make more money. Okay. Two more people that I want to, I want to just touch on before we close this out. And then if you have anything else you want to go into that school. But I actually did want to talk about Kevin O'Leary and why he's such a, like, okay, fine, fine. He supported FTX and he's kind of been supportive after the fact. Why are you leaning into him so hard? Like, what's the thing with Kevin O'Leary? Okay. There's a certain special kind of hate that you have for him at this point, which I don't understand. Well, he attacked me and I didn't like that. I don't know if people can tell if you attacked me, I'm going to uncover stuff about you and I'm going to crush you. It basically, like, I actually try to offer him some protection, you know, and say, like, maybe he's being forced to say this stuff. He's being forced. He was saying about Sam, like, because once again, does it make sense for Kevin to be in that 4% that supports him? He lost a lot of money through him. And when he's saying positive stuff about Sam, he got to be saying, like, why is he doing that? And so I started digging in and I started looking at what was going on. And he came and attacked me over some stuff that I said. And so once again, just crowdsource, hey guys, what's out there with Kevin or Larry? The stuff that I got back was absolutely shocking. I'm not going to go much into the deaths of the two people in a voting accident up in Toronto. I'll tell you this. Sorry, you're fine. I know the story. Yeah, yeah. I heard about it. Well, people on the ground that are very close to it, the vast majority of those people agree with what happened and it's not the story that was told. And, you know, one day I may go up there. It was a voting accident. Uh-huh. It was a voting accident where him and his wife were in a vote and then people died because the vote crashed. Yeah. They were both crashed and people died. Yeah. Kevin and Larry's voted or the vote that him and his wife were in crashed into another vote. What was he driving the vote towards there? Well, that's that's the, that's. I don't want to get, look, I want to keep this about money for him. Yes. Because I don't want to get too much into this. I'm just giving you context. Because I think, you know, we can get, we can borderline where people will sorry for him and turn him into the victim here. And I don't want that because he's done so much other bad stuff. But that is a whole other ball of wax that people can start digging into if they want. I'm going to stick to the crypto. Wondervy, one of the last companies. I've seen him promote it a lot. Well, yeah, it's his company. Yeah. One of the last companies to still continue giving SBF money and continuing giving FTX money. He had actually worked out to raise $8 billion to bail FTX out. And then everything came out and people were like, it was toxic. They're like, we don't want anything to do with this. He's trying to get his money back. So when you look at Wondervy, what it was doing in the overlap it had between Alameda, they weren't heavily in bed together. And then you start looking at Kevin O'Leary's exchange bit by in Canada. Yeah. And you start seeing a lot of the same hallmarks that you software FTX. Athlete promotions, right? FTX, they had Tom Brady. David Ortiz, Ed Steph Curry. Who is the biggest athlete in Canada for a long time? Kyle Lowry. Yeah. They win the Toronto Raptors. Kyle Lowry to prove that Super Bowl commercial FTX did a big Super Bowl commercial. Bit by did a huge Super Bowl commercial. You start getting into the way that the internals work. Very, very similar. Ran by a person with a big name, right? You start looking into Bit by. And there's more there. I don't have a sit in front of me. I can't remember 100% of the stuff that we haven't covered on it yet is of right now. But Bit by is another company that really fits in line with in Canada doing exactly what Sam was doing with FTX. So there are rumors of insolvency with Bit by. I've not been able to verify those. So I'm not going to come out and say that. But when you look at the relationship between Kevin O'Leary, also when you go to what Kevin O'Leary did promoting IPOs, there was a big lawsuit between him and Kevin Harrington were both named. They would basically, anything you would pay them to do, they would promote. They were, I can't remember what niche it was in. But there's a Facebook video of Kevin O'Leary. It looks like a cameo. Like you know what cameo? Yeah, yeah. It's going to blow the caviar. Yes, the caviar that he's, that they're using cameo to shoot it. Yeah. And then he's selling a caviar. Well, probably, I don't know anything about that. But like his promotion, it just sounds like cameo. It's just like, you know what, when I want to invest my money, I certainly want to invest my money in this IPO. It was an investment, the cameo. No, no, it's not literally cameo. He was having a cameo. I was about him. He was. No, I am actually that because I get, I don't know anything about that. So if you buy caviar, you're getting, I like caviar. You're going to get, he, I thought it was a blueberry the first time I ever ate it. No, no, no. It's true story. So he did promote the company. I don't think he didn't anymore. He just sells the caviar. Yeah. But what it was is there wasn't actual cameo on an ether because I assumed they first did it with cameo. Yeah. Just found out they're not allowed to use cameo for commercial reasons. Then he said, listen, I'm still promoting it and I'm endorsing it because I like it. So it wasn't trying to sell you anything. But it didn't look I mean, they were using cameo. I will say that people are allowed to promote. It was a sponsorship. It was clear about it. Okay, this is just one of many things. This, this is just one of many things. But what I, he got sued over over this one particular one that I'm talking about. Him and Kevin Harrington both got sued and they paid a bunch of money to settle it and got it covered up. He literally like the double talk that comes out of this guy's mouth is unbelievable. He literally says in the defense of the lawsuit, we have never heard of this company and I've never had a relationship with him. The answer from the company back was, no, we literally have videos of you promoting us. And his response was, yeah, obviously we did do promotions for your company. Like, but we have no relationship. We don't know y'all. But yeah, I mean, do informational videos or something that we do. And it makes no sense. But you want to get into the really dark stuff. The really dark stuff is we start getting into what happened with Celsius. Is the name. No, it's good. So when you get into what happened with Celsius, FTX was, look, Alps was Shensky and Celsius, they had the vulnerabilities. I look at, I look at Alps, Shensky, a lot more like I look at Dokwan or Susu at this point. Someone that had a lot of vulnerabilities inside of what he was doing. And they got crushed and taken advantage of by people that were smarter than him and knew how to manipulate markets better. And when you look at what happened with Celsius, Kevin, I'm a leery a week before Celsius crashed and went down. He literally went on coin desk, a crypto site. This has been removed, by the way. You have to dig to find this video. His team has been scrubbing all the videos of him talking about Celsius, where he literally predicted Celsius was going to zero. How would he know it? How, how would he think Celsius is going to zero when he, he's not even invested in Celsius. And as I mean, he knows internally, like none of us knew it. How did he know it? Well, it's because if you look at what FTX did, we never even got into the scam of on the back in what they were doing to projects. We have proof of this. We have evidence. We have video evidence of Dan Freiberg saying they counterfeit tokens on their markets. That's how they control the supply and control money going up and down. This is why you look at the long to short ratio on FTX. It's like 100% short. Because when the prices would drop or when the prices would start to get momentum, they would just counterfeit tokens on the market on their exchange to be able to control the supply and keep the prices suppressed. They did this to Celsius. They did this to Celsius. So Kevin O'Leary knew this and he just said it without thinking that, fuck, this is going to pay me as somebody who actually knows it's going on its own. 100%. Okay. Exactly. Okay. When you look at the coordination of the... Because if not, it would have just been a great business prediction. Right. Of course. Awesome. Business guru can pick the markets. Great. Good for you, Kevin O'Leary. You know what the fuck's happening. Yeah. So if you're... But, but when your best friend is Sam Bankman Frieden, you also know not only are they doing on this on the exchange, in addition, Sam has a gigantic short still open today. I believe on OKX or MEX-E on the cell token. So, Sam is shorting... It's almost like... What happened with the GameStop? You know, it's like... Yeah. Sam is over there shorting it to zero. Why? This is a very important point here within all of this. When you consider the insolvency holds that the FTX was in, they were always on a shot clock. We were on a shot clock to break this story before they acquired Voyager. If they were able to go through with the Voyager acquisition and then the next step, because of their own manipulation and crushing Celsius and creating a large insolvency gap on Celsius, they were then able to buy Celsius, which they were trying to do when all this stuff broke, then potentially they were able to buy a circle, which they were trying to come after a circle that the Goldman Sachs crypto arm behind USDC. They control the stablecoin market. They control the lending market. They control the exchange market. They control US regulation. They're able to hide the entire scam. This thing was not supposed to blow up overnight. Kevin O'Leary knew all this. It's so unbelievably obvious when you go back and you look at the stuff he was saying and we have stuff on chain that supports a lot of this. And then we know for sure that a business... That word is hard to say. We know, no, no, we know what I'm qualifying in the next statement. We know for sure 100% that part of the business model of FTX and Liquid was creating a counterfeit market and creating counterfeit coins of coins that are listed there. We know that for sure. There's zero percent down. We have video evidence. We have on-chain evidence, right? Why would they not be doing that with Celsius when they're shorting it to zero to try to buy it? I have a question for you. Yeah. So obviously if you are 100% in on this, there's going to be a point where you're going to have to be disposed and you're going to go forward. Yeah, for sure. Love it. But if you think about the people that you're actually going up against, the legal budgets they have are limitless. Yeah. How do you fight this? Well, we've got a lot of politicians outside too. It's very connected. It's not going to come out of your pocket. It should be the government. Yeah. It's not a simple. But the government's not going to go out for me simply. Who's going to be? What's the name of them? Who's going to be? You're a journalist. It's very easy to dismiss cases. I don't know. I don't know. Like what would it be? FTX's entire game. And also interesting enough. Funny, right? Kevin O'Leary's entire game. But there's other people. That'll make it. It's the most people that are bigger than SPF and Kevin O'Leary. Well, but am I going after them? Who am I going after? No, but they're going to try and defend maybe some of the stuff that he was going on. Okay. But these eventually go to discovery. When this goes to discovery, I have such a gigantic treasure trove of evidence. No one wants to go to discovery with me. I promise. I will invite it. You all want to sue me? Let's go. Let's go. He put out the evidence that I have and let's see if you get off the map. They know this. That's why I'm protected. They can't come after me because of what I have and they know what I have. Kevin O'Leary does not want to sue me because he does not want to go to discovery with anything. Sam Bankman freed fled the country in 2020 to Hong Kong running from a 2019 FTX lawsuit. Why? It got the furthest to discovery it had ever been in. He knew if that went to discovery, he was sunk. So they tried to pay new genesis, a project that this, the guy from New Genesis who is saying is where all my evidence has came from. He's been the collector. He's been waiting to swing a bunch of these guys forever. The fact is, they tried to settle with him $40 million dollars. And he said no. They tried to, I know another project. There's different. $1.5 million dollars was a starting point, basically. They would start with $1.5 million dollars settlement offers these projects that they screwed that had hard evidence on what they've been doing. And they would take the hush money. With who's saying they came up a guy who has money, has connections, was not who they thought he was. Very connected in a lot of different worlds to where he basically ratchet it up the pressure to get a higher and higher and higher, higher settlement the whole time knowing he was never going to accept it. And when people find out how bush leagans sloppy these people are, they'll understand why I'm so confident. This is not a gigantic cover-up. It's a bunch of stupid people not understanding the repercussions of their actions and thinking that they were untouchable. The evidence is so overwhelmingly plain and clear. Reef, a project that they screwed, told us everything. On March 15th of 2021, go look at the Medium article. They told you the extortion story. And nobody believed it. I didn't believe it. I laughed. Reef. That's a, that's a show project, you know? No. They had all, they had evidence back then and they literally published on Medium article and everybody looked the other way. Why? Don't fund my bags, bro. Don't, FTX is a great company. Why are you going to throw an FTX under the bus? Like, when you look at the business practice that you keep on the back end, you'll understand why I'm so confident. And I've got a gigantic mark. Marketing is such a, is such a powerful tool. When you look at the company, I think fast that went to 1.5 billion and then nothing and the actual process was just, just one page check out, which was nothing new. And they raised, I think, 100 million or so over just because they were always on the meat. And they had a $3,000 in per year revenue. There's nothing. And what happened is when you keep seeing it again and again, it comes down to the rule of seven. If you see it seven times within a short period of time, it looks reliable. Yeah. So if you hear FTX, FTX, FTX, FTX, FTX everywhere to now and then Brady and O'Leary and so on. And I just, you won't believe it's there. It's in front of your face. And I'm still, I'm going to read, I'm going to do it all right there in front of your face just because no one's going to believe that it's going to happen. And you asked a simple question, why is it in the Bahamas? Why aren't you showing up in the United States? Why? Just a basic question. Oh, I know why it was in the Bahamas. I know the literal reasons it was in Bahamas. Yeah. So that's the power of monocity. Well, they, well, you know why it was in the Bahamas? Because the, the Bahamas, I know we talked about, we've seen the evidence. They literally overlooked that there's a securities commission in the Bahamas. Literally overlooked the capital requirements to start an exchange there in the Bahamas. They did not have to prove funds to open up there. Wow. Yeah, why? Because they didn't have the funds. It was all fake. And we got into FTT and how they were able to use that token. There's a flywheel to be able to, to heavily inflate the overall value of their company. But, you know, what's the guy's name? Terry Duffy, I think. I can't remember the guy's exact name. He's the CEO of CME, which is another horrible company. But he did make some great points on, you know, St. Bankman Fried. He said when he met him, he, he said he started talking to him and asking questions. He said he saw he was a fraud right away. He said, you're, you're supposedly worth 25 billion dollars. Yeah, whatever Elon called his, called him out too. He said, yeah, I remember this thread on Twitter about him saying he got like red flag vibes from SBF. Yeah. He's actually liquid to the tune of two billion or whatever when he was trying to find money to go buy Twitter. Uh-huh. And somebody said, hey, you know, go talk to SBF. I can't remember who it was. And Elon's like, I don't think he's actually looking. Exactly. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't know that. Supposedly it came out this week. He says he has $100,000 in his bank account. That's all he has. No. He's got a lot of other companies with assets under them that know about. But when it comes to this, I think his name's Terry Duff. He made some of the fact check the name on this, the, the, the CEO of the CME or whatever it is. He said, something to the fact of like, I'm barely worth nine figure. I'm not worth 10 big 10 figures. And I guarantee you I have more money right now than you do. Wow. You know, so it's been a show game from the beginning. Every so many. Every couple of decades. Yes. Terry Duff. Terry Duff. Every couple of decades, there is, there is that story. It was, I would say in the 90s, there was a person. There was a, there was a, a few cinema movie rock trader. Yeah. It was, it was basically working for Brink. I think that was the name of the, the British bank that was there for 200 years and so on. And he just got it under, liquidated. Just because he did some bad trading in East Asia. I don't know, sorry. Yes. So he just, he just used, he, he was, he was managing fund for heavy wealth individuals. But then he got his traders to just go. I guess he was doing options. And he made sure that the options are always going to be green because the bank was leveraging all the money for a couple of big billionaires. And eventually when it was all found out, margin called boom, the whole bank went under and they bought it for something like five cents on a dollar bank that was there for years and years. And he was not, he was not, no one wanted to look into the books because he was the rock star trader that brought so much business into the bank. So it was untouchable. There was always the part where those regulators get off formula with them with Bernie Sanders now with SBF. So it's just, it's always going to come. Bernie Sanders. Bernie Sanders as well. He's just going to take your money with him and he's going to be okay. That's a different right? He's going to take up. What a rebrand. Yeah. So. All right. Wow, dude. That was wild. We got wild. Okay. We got to do it part two. Okay. Yeah. But we are going to do this. We are going to write down when we start the video saying everything that you hear over here. It's Ben's opinion. Do not shoot us in the street. I don't have one Kevin O'Leary as my enemy. Have you seen him he's frail? Come on, man. You blow him over. All right. Let's close this out. Okay. So like just closing thoughts for the audience. Like this is like obviously got really, really like really in the weeds. Yeah. But just like close out, you know, future of crypto. Where do you see it going? Yeah. What are you hopeful for? What are you excited about? Crypto is great. None of this has anything to do with crypto. None of this has anything to do with Bitcoin. It's a great point too. None of this has anything to do with blockchain. It has to do with centralization and centralized powers. Good point. It's a story of greed. And it's a story of manipulation. Elites power control. Great reset. The whole nine yards. It's everything that it was actually created to fight. Hmm. Continue to be the problems. And so for me personally, I've always said this. I've always said, you know, you're back at what we were talking about the Catholic church and the printing press and stuff. Like, you know, look, we're heading to a dark place in the world. I think a lot of people would agree with that and they see that. Things do swing back and forth. But the current trajectory when you look at the WEF, when you look at power structures, elites, it's scary where things can go. I'm not going to be able to sit here and tell you that blockchain, crypto, Bitcoin, that they are going to save us. What I'll tell you is there are only chance if this new financial infrastructure does not work and does not is not able to restore privacy in our transactions. And we were able to get digital dollars and CBDCs to where every single thing you do can be tracked. You're going to need a CPA. They're going to have all the information already in real time at all times. They're no exactly how much you owe. They know when you buy something you can't afford. It's a very terrifying thing to think about. Maybe your opinion. They cut your ability off to spend money. It's very scary where the world is going. We have to have crypto. We have to weed out these bad actors. We have to weed out the stock market 2.0. Crypto is not traditional finance. If you are looking at this, like you think this needs to turn into Wall Street, then you need to get out because we don't want you. Let me ask you if you had to choose Bitcoin or Ethereum. Which one? You have to. Oh, man. Look, I love Ethereum. I think Ethereum trade. I think eventually Cardano passes Ethereum. It's just me. It's a better infrastructure and the way they built it is better. But in terms of investment, I do think Ethereum is a better investment. Not what I enjoy about it. The tokenomics of Ethereum are now superior to the tokenomics of Bitcoin because until Bitcoin hits many, many, many, many but Bitcoin having cycles down the road, the inflation rate of Bitcoin is going to be higher than the new inflation rate of Ethereum based on the Ethereum merge. To me, I think the tokenomics are better. Bitcoin as sovereign money is better. But right now, Bitcoin is digital gold. I don't know. I actually kind of think Ethereum is better. But look, we love Bitcoin. Bitcoin started this entire space. We are everything to the group. I believe the group of cypherbunks have created the monochrome. Bitcoin will always have a gigantic place in the space. I believe Ethereum's market cap will eventually pass Bitcoin. And it has better things to offer because the tokenomics are superior now and also when it comes to decentralization, excuse me, what comes to the decentralized internet, which Ethereum will be the basis for. I think a decentralized internet is a better, you know, return on investment than just digital gold. That makes sense. Makes sense. Awesome. Do you have any one memorable part from this podcast? I do have. I'll say mine. Okay. We spoke a lot. I feel like we're doing like a sharing story. I would say my most memorable something you said that I've never thought about is when I asked you the question about the maneuvers and you said and I told you look, they're going to create a better platform. I said, yeah, but that centralized your kids are screwed. We're all screwed. They know everything about us. That probably was the biggest aha moment in that. I'll give you mine. I think my favorite part is actually thinking you just said that none of the shit that we just spoke about for the past two hours is anything to do with crypto or Bitcoin or DeFi or blockchain or have three. Good one. I think that's actually if anybody has listened this far, I really hope that that's what they take away. Yeah. I hope so as well. I mean, the future is bright. We're going through a purge right now. We go through a purge every four years. There's nothing new that we've seen in crypto. This should not shake people's confidence in where the space is going. It should actually improve it. Cool. Thank you so much for being with us. There'll be number two. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you, Matt. I appreciate you a lot.