Jason Hanson - Founder of Spy Escape & Evasion | Spy Secrets That Can Save Your Life

Today my guest is Jason Hansen. Jason spent nearly a decade as a CIA officer earning two exceptional performance awards and learning these secrets of espionage and survival. He left the agency to pursue his passion of teaching ordinary citizens how to protect themselves and their families from danger. He is the founder and CEO of Spy Escape and Evasion, a company that offers training courses, product and online resources on spy skills and safety. He is also the author of the New York Times bestseller Spy Secrets that can save your life, which reveals how to escape kidnappers, prevent identity theft, evade a home invasion and more. Jason has shared his expertise on numerous TV shows, including the Rachel Ray Show, Today, Date Line and Shark Tank, where he won a deal with Damon John. He also created and performed a one-man show in Las Vegas called Spy Escape and Evasion, which showcases real spy tradecraft, a little bit of humor and intrigue. Jason is a sought-after keynote speaker who delivers engaging and informative presentations globally on security, survival and success. Welcome to Success Story. I'm your host, Scott Clary. The Success Story podcast is part of the HubSpot podcast network. For everyone listening, I just have to ask you a question. Do you want to know what separates the contenders from the pretenders, the A-list from the C-list, world champions from the world, not champions? It's pretty simple. The fourth quarter. In sports, more importantly, for a lot of the people listening here in business, finishing strong is key. Now HubSpots, New Sales Hub is the software that you need for your sales and your sales team to win Q4. You could be a solo printer, you could own and run a larger business, regardless if you're selling anything to anyone, which I think a lot of the people who are listening to this are, you need to check out Sales Hub. There is a new prospecting workspace. There's revamped deal management tools. There's smart sequencing. Sales Hub is loaded with everything you need to turn leads into prospects and then convert those prospects into customers. With Sales Hub, you have the right information at the right time to build better relationships, which means closing deals has never been easier. This Q4 give yourself and your team the tools to win big with HubSpots Sales Hub. Learn more at HubSpot.com slash sales. I'm in an Eagle Scout and as an Eagle Scout, I was blessed to do a ton of camping, a ton of playing in the woods, a ton of shooting BB guns and doing all that and I remembered and I was like, hey, when I get older, I don't want to have a job where I'm sitting behind some desk, I don't want to push a bunch of papers and all that. I want to do something where I can be running around shooting people with BB guns or doing something like that. I remember thinking that and then when I got to college, same thing, I was like, well, I don't really want to get a desk job where I'm some corporate guy for 40 years. Hey, I should join the CIA or the secret service or something like that. That was kind of my path to the agency. Because I always wonder what makes somebody want to join the CIA and I'm wondering if it's too many movies growing up or if it's because their dad or their mom was in it or you just wanted something different. My dad was an entrepreneur. He ran his own company as a computer company. My mom was a schoolteacher. Nobody, no agency in the background in my family or anything like that. It was pretty much a sense of adventure to do something different, kind of having a adrenaline rush and I'm still not adrenaline junky to this day. I get bored very easily, but yeah, that was the foundation. Was it, was it like what you thought it would be when you, when you, I mean, it's slowed down before it speeds up, right? Because I'm assuming lots of paperwork, lots of yeah. Well, I always tell people, listen, if Hollywood was the real CIA, you know, sure, that'd be great and crazy, but of course it's not. You know, if Hollywood showed what it was actually like in the agency every day, nobody go to the movies because clearly you're not jumping out of copters. You're not driving a mazerotic down the streets of Europe and everything. You're trying to blend in to your surroundings. So it's like many other things. It's 99% hard work, 99% nothing happens and 1% hang on for the gray ride. So when you, when you go through this process and every time, you know, I have these, these questions, I, I, I want you to say as much as you're able to say because I think it's really an interesting process to go through to onboard into the CIA. What is it really like? What is the onboarding, the training, the, you know, what are the skills that you've learned in college that can be transferable or is it just blank slate? It's a certain kind of person that is born to make it in the CIA and, and you know, if you're not that person, you're never going to make it like walk me through that whole process. It's a very long process. So from the point that I apply, and most people apply, so there's that myth that everybody gets recruited. Usually the guys that get recruited speak 17 languages or have a connection to Iran or you know, they've got, they're like some super genius. But us, quote unquote, normal people, most of us apply. So from the time I applied to the time I actually got the job and walked into headquarters, it was probably 12 months. So it's a, it's a very long process. First, of course, you apply and then they reach out to you and you fill out mounds of paperwork. I'm sure more of it's online these days, but you fill out a ton of paperwork. Then they bring you in and you've got to get polygraphed. Then they bring you in, you got to get a medical. Then they bring you in, you got to meet with a, a camera from was a psychologist or psychiatrist, but they've basically bring you in to take all these tests to make sure you're not a nut job and you're not allowed to take an all that kind of thing. So there's multiple different processes. And every, every time, of course, you get kicked out, you cannot make it. And obviously, I didn't make it, but yeah, it was probably a year before they send you the letter and basically say, hey, congratulations. We would like to offer you a job with the agency. You know, if you accept, here's your start date and I still have that letter somewhere in a box buried in my attic or whatever. But yeah, it's not, it's not easy. It's a pain in the butt. They of course background check you and talk to your neighbors and friends and this and that and all types of things. And I know it is, I've heard it's got looser these days, meaning I've never done drugs in my life. And of course, they check that. They ask you that on the polygraph. And I can't remember what someone told me, but I heard like, hey, if you haven't done drugs in the last five years, then you can do it. So unfortunately, like all of life and society, they're loosening standards. But it was, I mean, it was a long process. I made it. It was a pain in the butt. I hate paperwork, but obviously, I'm glad I did it. Yeah, I know. I actually, um, a lot of what you're, you're, you're discussing, actually brings true to me because my dad was in Ceasis. I'm Canadian. So I think that I, you know, I remember for office Christmas parties, we would go in and he'd like take me to the polygraph to mess with me as a kid. That's awesome. But yeah, but it was, it's, it's a totally different world. But I do think that I remember because my obviously entrepreneur now, podcasting is sort of my thing, but growing up, it was always a thought you go into law enforcement and whatnot. And I think that at that time, any sort of drug in your entire life was not acceptable. But I even think that it was more lenient than maybe 20, 30 years ago. And I could totally be misquoting, but I think at one point, like tattoos were unacceptable. And then it just got, you know, it was like even more strict going back and back and back. And then eventually it starts to get more lenient and with the times, but still such a fascinating career. So, um, when you, when you, when you go down this path, I mean, obviously when you're going through this training, you don't necessarily think at some point you're going to be an entrepreneur or do you, do you plan in the future? Is this something that just happens to you or do you plan an exit at any point? I wish I was that smart. I wish I was that intelligent. I've always had the entrepreneur but bug. But you know, when I joined the agency, it was my dream job. I was gung ho. I was like, this is amazing and everything. So for me to say, Hey, you know, I played it out where I was going to join. I was going to wear an X amount of years and then I was going to start my own security coming. I'm doing now. No, none of that is true. But I was with the agency seven years. Wonderful place to work. I love it, but it's a single man's game. So I had these amazing mentors and a lot of them were, so I joined it 23. So I joined young, but these guys were in their 50s, great amazing CIA officers, but a lot of them were divorced or they had horrible relationships with their wife and kids and they were like crap. I got to be home now where they'd rather be off doing something else. And I kind of saw the writing on the wall. I was single at the time. So it's fine. But I was like, you know, I kind of want to get married. I want to have some kids someday. I want to have a quote unquote more normal life. So I did leave the agency after seven years and I loved what I did. Meaning I love security. I love personal protection. I love self defense. It's my passion. So it was kind of like, Hey, I want to start my own business. I got to do something now that I'm leaving the agency. And why don't I do something that I'm good at that I know and that I really enjoy. Is it is it hard to leave the agency and and build something do they support that process and also sort of I don't like doing two part questions, but the second part also ties into it. Is it hard to leave the agency and become a public figure and put yourself out there and talk about some of the things that maybe you learned and you don't want to cross the line of talking about things you shouldn't talk about. But some of it obviously helps you build your own brand and your own career. So as far as hard to leave the agency is not like the movies where they're going to lock you in the basement and never lay out and you can never lay that's that's Hollywood myth. What's hard is that you have your top secret security clearance. So I had a T S S C I with lifestyle poly, which means you're golden for life. You're set for life. If you have that top secret security clearance, you never got to worry about a job. Again, you're set. So that's hard leaving that, especially when I didn't go to Harvard Business School, meaning I went to college. My very first job was a police officer, but then I very quickly joined the CIA. So it's not like I had any business experience. I had been a government employee my entire life. So what was really hard was one, leave the security clearance. And two, they obviously try and convince you to stay. So my leaders at the time, great people are like, hey, Jason, you're doing a great job working on project. We really need you. And I did stay a little longer than I anticipated. So I did say several more months to help with a certain thing. So it was more of like hey, they're trying to convince you. They don't want to lose you, but as a strong army, you were threatening none of that happens. And I left the agency on great terms. So get no complaints whatsoever with the agency. When I left, I was doing a lot of corporate stuff. So it was almost as if these corporations were sneaking me in the back door. And because all I knew was a government life, I'd go into these Fortune 500 companies, multi-billion dollar corporations. And they'd be like, you know, we have this kidnapping problem in Brazil. We need you to help us with. And in our whole security team, we've got four people, one guy's in America, one guy's in Australia, one guy's in England. And it was a big eye opening for me like, wait a minute, you're a multi-billion dollar corporation. And your main security team consists of these four guys. And half of them have no real experience. I don't know what they're doing. So I was doing a lot of that. And I was under the radar. Nobody knew what I did. But then the show Shark Tank, somebody mentioned to me the show and said, hey, you should go on it. And because I was former CIA, you know, I love going under the radar. I just, I don't want anybody to know what I'm doing. I was very, very private. And I had this a mentor. And he said to me, Jason, are you good at what you do? And I said, yeah. And he said, do you think it'll help people? And I said, yes. And he says, then you've got to get out there and promote yourself. So now I'm fortunate where I've been on dozens of shows. I've written the New York Times bestselling book. But I did that because I realized, hey, if I want to share my message, I've actually, again, got to promote myself. So it's not something that is natural to me. Meaning like before going on Shark Tank, I was like, no, I don't really think I want to do this. I'm not going to do this. And I kind of did it hesitantly. However, it was amazing. Huge blessing. I'm glad I did it. So even to this day, it's kind of, I don't know, I, you know, Dr. Jekyll, Mr. Hyde thing where the real me is super private. Nobody knows where I live. I've got a circle of very close friends, but not a huge bunch of friends. And so the real Jason is not a social butterfly as a very, very private person. But again, I love what I do. I love my business. And I want to tell people about it. So that's the part of, yeah, I'm, you know, I'm fortunate that I get to go on places like yours because I knew I want to spread the word. I think it's, it's a, it's a, it's a probably a hard transition coming from a life of privacy and whatnot, putting yourself out there. But it's like, it's a really smart jump to take. If you, if you can do it and you can put your entire self behind it, Shark Tank is not the easiest place to come out though. I mean, you've probably picked one of the most high pressure environments with a totally different kind of pressure. When you, when you thought, okay, I will do Shark Tank. You didn't have, you had business experience because you're, you know, you're doing some of these corporate engagements and whatnot. But what was the, what was the process behind figuring out what you actually want to pitch to them? Because it wasn't like you were the entrepreneur that had three, four attempts at building a product and taking it to market and going, so it's, it's something that was even novel for Shark Tank, right, which they see a certain kind of product again and again and again. So how did you think through what am I going to pitch? What's it going to be worth? What, what valuation am I going to take on this type of product and service? So walk me through that. Sure. So I do a lot of training for, so when I was doing this corporate stuff, a lot of these guys would bring me to train their families, their wives, their cousins, uncles, aunts. So I was doing a ton of training with high net worth individuals. And a lot of it was escaping evasion training and self-defense training. So hey, here's how to escape duct tape. Here's how to escape rope. Here's how to pick logs. Here's how to become a human line detector so you can read people better. So it was all this kind of training and people loved it and really enjoyed it. And I was getting hired for celebrities. And this and that and doing all kind of stuff, but still under the radar. So what I did was I pitched this escape and evasion training. This live kind of event that I was doing with this celebrities and small group, but bringing it into the masses. And how did I prepare? Well, how you prepare for everything in life, how you prepare the agency is deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep, deep research. So I'm not exaggerating when I literally watched every episode of Shark Tank. I literally watched every single interview that any of the sharks had done, whether it was Damon John or Mark Cuban or anybody. I knew those people better than they knew themselves. It's, I mean, it's intelligence 101, meaning know your target better than them know themselves. And I'll tell you a story. I can't name the name, but there's a very successful businessman who was kind of helping me. And I, he wrote me this really nice email that just said, basically, hey, Jason, you know, your business is going to be incredible. You're a hard worker. You're going to go to the like really nice thing. And he's a well-known guy. And so I was doing my research, watching all these television shows that entrepreneur, or that these entrepreneurs had been on like Damon John, Mark Cuban, Barbara, and you know, Mr. Wonderful and all these. And I saw Damon John with some interview, some, I don't even remember what it was, like some TV station. And he mentioned this businessman's name that was a friend of his. And so going into Shark Tank, I had the businessman's nice note. He sent me printed on a piece of paper. I took it out of my suit jacket. And I said, Hey, Damon, like, guess what? Here's what so and so said to me. And he's a friend of mine. I saw Damon's eyes light up. I knew I was, I was going at that point. Now strangely enough, this businessman, after I went on Shark Tank, the Shark Tank producer sent me an email and said, Hey, you know, we need his permission to use his name to use this thing. I emailed him and he didn't want me to use it, which is weird because it would have promoted him. So I can't name him because he was like, no, Jason, I don't want you to tell anybody about that it was me who said this and he wants to remain private. So obviously, I respect his privacy. But that deep, deep research helped me land a deal on Shark Tank with Damon John. And, and were you, were you happy with that deal? Because when I look at that deal, that's an expensive piece of equity. It was what 100 and 50,000 for 45% of the company, which is that's significant. 45% of the company is a lot. So here's, here's the thing. Most of the deals that happen there change afterwards. And I found out, talking to many people, I might have been Damon who told me this, I can't remember who, that of the deals made on TV, only about 30% of them closed in real life because entrepreneurs will go on the show and they'll say things like, hey, my business is doing $10 million and then they look at the real books and the business is doing $100,000. So they obviously exaggerate. Now, everything checked out for me. You know, my business was good and we did a deal together for one year. So now I own 100% of my business, everything. And Damon was great. I love him. Obviously, I had a lot of connections that I didn't have in the business world. But these guys do so many deals. I don't want to say it's superficial because it was wonderful. And I can call him and email him every time I need him. But it was a one year thing. I learned some stuff from him. And now, you know, again, I'm 100% owner of my business. Okay, that makes sense because I saw that deal. And I'm like, that's that's that's significant. That's not a, that's not an easy amount of equity to, but you know, it's nice to hear like success stories from Shark Tank because I have heard as well that some of the deals don't get done. And it's probably, you know, no one's fault other than they don't portray themselves the way they, they should on on TV, which is silly to me, but it is, it is what it is. So when you work out this deal with with Damon, talk, talk to me about the next year of your business. How does Damon help? What does he bring to the table outside of money? Where do you strategically go? Because I love your story because you're not an entrepreneur. And you didn't have the corporate experience. But then you built something that's very successful, including the personal brand. So I want to highlight some of the strategic moves that you took that Damon maybe advised you to take that you figured out on your own, whatever it is. Yeah, I mean, it was chaos. It was always this. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it was be figuring things out. So like I said, I could call, I can email Damon and get his advice. I mean, one thing that happened is after going on Shark Tank, who was it? Penguin Random House reached out to me. And they said, Hey, we'd like to have you to write a book. We do this. They gave me a nice, hefty advance. And I wrote a book which we, it became a New York Times best seller, which obviously awesome. And I'm grateful for and I've sent written, I think over a dozen books now. So that book was obviously a great thing to come after that. And then I'm a gear junkie. So it's products that I wanted. I started creating knives and creating tactical pens and creating all this stuff because I love gear. I've got my bug out bags. I've got all that stuff. So started selling gear. I have my 320 acres spy ranch that's in Utah. And I had actually purchased that before Shark Tank aired. So it was I can't remember how it went because Shark Tank, you know, has a delay like you go take the show. It's taped. And then that was a delay of four or five months. So before I went and again, I can't even remember but I had purchased this and I think on the show I said I was going to purchase because I was going to purchase it at the time. And what I'm about to say goes back to you got to trust your gut and believe in yourself no matter what anybody says. So I have another guy I know kind of a mentor incredibly successful businessman worth hundreds millions of dollars. And I told him, Hey, I'm going to buy this 300 acres in Utah. And I'm going to turn into spy ranch. We're going to do a base of driving. We're going to do escape and evasion all this stuff. And he was like, Now I don't think I like that idea, right? You know, I wouldn't do that. I fire you. And so Mark Cuban on Shark Tank basically said the same thing like, Hey, you're an idiot. You're a knucklehead. Don't do it. Well, I ended up buying the 320 acres. I ended up creating spy ranch and it's been one of the most successful things of all. I people that have come from all over the world to train a spy ranch in a base of driving. And I actually just last week was our ultimate spy week, which is a five day venture. Again, people came from all over the world to attend this. And it was great. So again, going back to what I said earlier is I had two very, very, very successful businessmen tell me not to do it. I knew the training offer was great. I knew it would be worth a while. So I did it anyway. And it's been a massive, massive success. So that is another thing that's happened. And it's overall has been wonderful. I've been fortunate. I do. We got a bodyguard division that is executive protection for musicians and celebrities. We do consulting. We do home security audits where I go to very wealthy people's house and do home security audits. So we're doing a ton of stuff. It's great. Like I said, Shark Tank was, I was initially like, no, I don't think I want to do this. I don't think I want to go on TV because I'm very prime and personal, but well worth it. I think that a couple of lessons, they're obviously that just jump in and figure it out less. And when it comes to testing something new, but also you had massive, a massive amount of confidence in what you knew and what you were doing. And I think that yes, mentors are definitely really important. But ultimately, if you know what you're doing and you're obsessed with it, like you will find a way to make it work. But you have to be the level of obsession that you have to have with the product or service that you're bringing to market has to be above and beyond. And I mean, you lived in this world and your perspective was so unique. And that's what differentiated and that's probably what would make your business. And this ranch and this whole ecosystem successful when somebody who maybe thinks it's a good idea, but doesn't understand how to deliver this product in the best possible way if they tried to emulate you, it would have flocked because it's probably a very difficult business to build and to scale properly. So you have to be so in it, and you have to have so much experience. And that's what you have. That's what you bring to the table. I'm very curious. What are the, if I'm going to ask you the skills that you learned in the CIA that were the most transferable to business, what skills pop into your mind? Hard work, being on time and being able to sell ice to an Eskimo. So there's a friend of mine and I love her saying she says spies are the world's best salesman. The only difference is you sell vacuums, we sell treason. So you've got to be socially comfortable with everybody. So in real life, as I mentioned earlier, I'm more of an introvert. I'm, you know, I'm the guy, if I go to a party, my wife will mingle and talk and I have no desire to talk. It's just I don't need too many. I don't have it. However, I can't, meaning I'm perfectly comfortable going anywhere and everywhere, whether I'm dealing with a billion dollar client of mine or whether it's the guy next door who makes $30,000 a year. Again, I'm totally comfortable everywhere. I can talk to anyone. So that's probably the most transferable and important skill is your social skills to be able to communicate to people to get done to be able to read people, obviously, is a very important skill. So that yeah, that's by far one of the most valuable things from the agency. What, what do you think people screw up in terms of sales and communication when they're trying to sell product or service that you see this immediately when you talk when you speak to somebody or somebody tries to pitch you on something. One they haven't done the research. So for instance, I've never sent a text message in my life. I use a flip phone in my books and I probably told this to about a million people, right? So I will get people who eventually reach out to somebody in my company and say, hey, I've been texting Jason, a friend of a friend gave me his phone number. I have this great business idea. You know, I want to partner with them. I'm like, well, clearly didn't do your research. If you've been texting me because I've never, you know, so, so it's if you're trying to go after me because I people, I'm always looking to invest in businesses in the survival niche, meaning whether it's a knife company, gun company, security company, I love what I do and I buy businesses and all that kind of stuff. So if you're coming to me, which I have people all the time and they say, hey, Jason, I want you to invest in my knife company or this and that. And again, they say, hey, I've sent you a text message or hey, blah, blah, blah, I'm like, you didn't do any research. You are trying to ask me for a significant amount of money. You're trying to ask me to partner where I'm very, very busy with all my other businesses. So that's probably the biggest turn off is people not doing their homework, which is easy these days with social media. It's not like it's hard back in the day gathering intelligence. And then I say the other thing is making sure that the right fit. So again, when I'm, you know, people come to me like I literally try and turn them away. I'm like, here's what's going to happen. Here's the way it's going to work. Here's what's going to need to be. It's very, very expensive to work with me. I'm talking consulting and all that kind of stuff. Here's what we'll talk. And so it's almost like, does this work for you or not? We're, you know, too many people are like, hey, I will do anything to make the next buck. I don't care if this, and I'm just making this up, this magic nutrition pill is right for you. I'm going to shove it down your throat. So I'm always like, hey, does it make sense? Does, are you going to be a good fit? Now, of course, the caveat is I'm blessed where I'm not broke. I don't need money. I'm not good about to go homeless. So that's easy for me to say versus some guy who needs to sell that next pill or he's not going to be able to feed his family tonight. I think that I know the answer to this and I think that is probably going to hinge on research. But when you level yourself up, again, you've leveled yourself up as a, as a business leader very quickly. Then you've had mentors and you keep repeating the fact that you've researched an incredible amount, which I think is very, very smart. But when you look at how fast you've leveled up, you've built multiple successful businesses. Now you invest in businesses. What would the other or the, the secret thing that you obsessively focus on that allows you to learn how to do something new exceptionally well outside of research and mentors, which I'm sure play obviously a huge part. Is there any other sort of things that you internalize as a, as a business leader and upskilling yourself? First over 12 hours a day. I get about 5am. I shut down at 5pm because I got six kids. So obviously I want to be with them and they're still young since I left the agency. I mean, I didn't have kids until after I left the agency. So one, 12 hour days and two, find the best in the world. So people reach out to me like some billionaire hires me for consulting or whatever. He wants the best in the world. He reaches out to pay, it means basically good amount of money. Well, I do the same thing. If I'm trying to learn something and, you know, I'm just making this up. If somebody said, hey, Jason, I want you to invest in my, my pie business, my apple pie business, right? What I wouldn't, but you know what I mean? Just seems like, hey, I want you to invest in my apple pie business. I would go find the best person in the world of the apple pie business and hire them or go to them. So my network these days, because I have so many very high successful business clients, as I'm so blessed to reach out to me like, hey, you know, I know you're the best in the world when it comes to supplements, nutritional supplements. Are you know, you're the best in the world when it comes to how to make leather wallets? So I go to them and hire them and say, you know, I want to pay you for an hour of consulting. Tell me what I need to know. Is this apple pie business good? So I'm all about short cutting everything these days, because I don't have the time. We live in a world of experts. I've got the six kids that I want to spend time with. So I'm very, very efficient and obsessive with my time, which is why I've never sent a text message in my life. Well, one of the reasons, because I was going to ask that next. That was my next question. Well, security, safety, and we all know the world spends way too much time on their phone, not paying attention to everything is going on. And I literally, like, if you have something important, call me, get in touch with me. But otherwise, I don't want to be bothered because I'm working and I love what I do. And that's pretty much what it is, too, is throughout the day, unless I'm doing something like, you know, you and I are talking doing, I want to be in my office. Nobody knows where this office is either, meaning, I don't, because my employees are remote and everything and all that. But this isn't an office where people can come and hang out and shoot the ball. It's like, nobody knows where this office is. There's no spy ranch sign or spy Jason sign on the office. It's a little, it's like a CIA safehouse kind of thing. And that's the way I want it to be because I like to work. I don't want to be bothered. I just want to take a second and thank the sponsor of today's episode, HubSpot. Now, as you all know, the success story podcast is part of the HubSpot podcast network. There are incredible podcasts in this network. One of my favorites that you have to check out. If you don't know this podcast, you're kind of sleeping on it. The Gold Digger podcast hosted by Jenna Kutcher. This podcast has been around for a minute. Jenna is an OG in the podcast game. The Gold Digger podcast helps you discover your dream career with productivity tips, social strategies, business hacks, inspirational stories, interviews, and so much more. Please go check out the Gold Digger podcast hosted by Jenna Kutcher, wherever you get your podcasts. And I think that also, you know, you have your life very meticulously laid out and I can see that. I mean, family's very important to you. I want to talk about the balance with your family. Obviously, six kids is not a small amount of kids. That's a significant amount of children that you know, you have to give attention and love to. And it's so interesting that that was a this this thread goes throughout your life. It was something that was bugging you when you're in the agency that you saw broken families. I see it a lot with high performers and obviously never been in law enforcement or any sort of situation like that. But I see it a lot with people in entrepreneurship, CEOs, executives, third, fourth wife. And I mean, it's just very sad. But you're doing it all with six kids with, you know, a wife you love with a beautiful family. You're putting in 12 hour days. But I think that with all the success stories that I sort of cover here, I think that unfortunately, that's not always the norm to be able to balance everything effectively. And I want to we're going to go into all the all the fun stuff that you teach over in a second. But one last point about you and your life and your family. How do you manage it all? I know it's important to you that it goes without saying it's important to you obviously. But how do you manage it all? What are some tricks for other high performers that want to have the connection with their family that you have? So first, I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Ace Saints. So I'm a Christian. I think if you're not religious, it's tough. So whatever your religion is, obviously, to each his own. But I think you've got to be religious. So I know, I've said I know for a fact. I haven't met God yet. But I'm pretty darn sure that when I meet God one day, he's not going to be like, Jason, you only made a million dollars a year. If you would have made 10 million dollars a year, you would have come into heaven. I'm pretty sure he could care less about the amount of money I'm making. So I think it's very hard for business guys who are not religious to to keep things together. And I know these guys. I know these guys are incredibly successful and they don't have kids. And they're like, I don't want kids to get in the way. I don't want to waste my time. Kids will take away from my business. And it's like, we're supposed to be here to have families to have kids and all that. And I tell a very successful businessman, friend of mine, and he's an entrepreneur and he and his wife are going to ready to have kids. And I said, listen, here's one of the best reasons to have kids. Us entrepreneurs, we love learning things. We love challenges. We love doing things different. That's what kids are. You know, you're going to learn so much by having kids. You're going to do things you would have never done in your life. I mean, you know, Thanksgiving and Halloween are coming up soon, right? And it's like, we go to the pumpkin patch every year. And it's a grown man. I'm never going to go to a pumpkin patch and get a fight on our kids. So, you know, I find myself doing these things where I'm like, if I didn't have kids, there's never in a million years that I would be doing new in this activity. But it makes you learn and makes you get out of there. So I would first say, you got to be religious helps, whatever your religion is. And then second, we're all familiar with a deathbed thing. You know, nobody ever sent on their deathbed. Hey, I want to work more hours kind of thing. But, you know, play the long game, meaning, okay, I'm going to, I always play the long game with everything I do. So I look 10 years down the road. I look 20 years down the road. I look 30 years down the road. And for every single thing I do, and enough people that don't play the long game these days, they're looking for the quick hit. They're looking for the, you know, the quick buck. So I play the long game and say, okay, even though I never plan to retire because I love what I do, there is going to come a day where I'm like, you know what, I don't want 12 hour days. I only want to work a certain amount of days. That's everything. So I look at that long game of, okay, retirement Jason, Jason with his grandkids, and a lot kind of stuff and say, okay, to get there, what do I have to do? But also, what do I not want to regret? So I think if you really take that long game view that is hugely helpful, and hey, do you want to be lonely and miserable and by yourself at age 70? No, and guess what? I know those guys. I have those guys of clients and every single one of them regrets it because they build these great companies. But again, they're lonely, they're miserable, they're by themselves. So that's just some of my two cents. I think it, I think it's good to have more people that speak about how to balance these, these two parts of your life. I never thought about the religion playing a big part in it, but I think that I don't think you're wrong. I think that maybe it just, it makes you think about things that are, you know, like when you're an entrepreneur, you're very competitive. And you need to win in everything. But sometimes, if you win too much, you think that you're that important. And you forget that there's other things that are more important than you in life. And I just wish people would think about that earlier. I think one of the big things that helped me is, one, I mean, I'm very competitive. I've got a massive ego. Now, all of us with a massive ego, we hide it. I mean, we don't walk around like jerks. I guess when I say massive, you know, I mean, massive self confidence because you have to, right? And so I think one of the things that helped me is when you're with the agency, the stakes are very high, right? When you go to the business world, and I've talked to my buddies who are former special forces like Navy Seals or Delta, whatever. And it's like, when you go to the business world, it's like, yes, you want to win. Yes, you want to be competitive. But the stakes are that high, meaning nobody's going to die. Nothing's going to have a national security. So that's one of the helpful things is even though I admit, I hate it when things go wrong, even though I get very angry. At the end of the day, I'm like, you know, again, nobody's going to die. Nobody's going to get a hood put over their head and take them to a foreign prison to be tortured. So the stakes are much, much lower, even though I take it very, very seriously. Yeah. That makes a lot of sense to just the perspective that you have. I think that you start to realize that, you know, the next comma in the bank account is, it's nice. But at the end of the day, it's just another common bank account, the game very badly want to win. Yeah. Yeah. But also, you know, I think that if you play infinite games in business, there's no reason why you don't play these games in relationships, meaning there's never an end to working on a marriage or never an end to working on a relationship with your kids. I mean, marriages have the relationship will have a season of ups and downs and it won't always be perfect. And I think that, you know, you talked about you don't text a lot because it waste time. I think that technology rooms are focused and makes us always wanting the next thing quicker, including relationships because then we see all these other options on social media, kind of like if we're always distracting ourselves with business influencers that are, you know, showing us their jets and their cars. Well, like, why can't I get it now? Why can't I get everything now? You know, the hotter, the hotter partner, the bigger car or the bigger, whatever, the bigger house. So it's this really toxic thing that I think we have to sort of filter out because we're just inundated with all these signals that are not necessarily healthy. Okay. Let's talk about some of the fun stuff that you teach over. I thought it was very interesting because I was going on your YouTube channel and I actually looked at the number one video that was on your YouTube channel was how to disappear and then there was one about how to escape from zip ties and then there was one about improvised weapons in your home. And I'm actually curious, maybe you have perspective on this as to why people are so interested in this kind of content because I don't feel like the average person wants actually wants to disappear. Maybe I'm totally wrong, but 6.3 million people watch the video on how to disappear. Why do you think this content hits home with people in such a massive way? That is a great question. So yeah, most of what I do, as I said, is personal security training or self-defense training. I teach a ton of self-defense classes that keeps me very busy. So that's what most of the people want to hear, but you're right, for the how to disappear. I'm guessing it's more curiosity, meaning so many people these days don't love their lives. So many people, I can't remember which author was that Thoreau who said most men live quiet lives of desperation. So I think there's a lot of people who work these jobs and are born out of their mind and they're just like, huh, if I just disappear from my wife and kids and went to Mexico, how do I do? I think it's kind of a fantasy thing, but I could be totally wrong. That's my guess though. That's so interesting. So you know, when you look at your personal view on life, these are all things that you've learned throughout your career, but also you have your own survivalist mentality built in. You have I think two years worth of food storage saved away for yourself. How important is that? Why is that important to you? Obviously it's important to you. You've done it. Why is that important to you? What is a lesson that other individuals should learn from? Is this not hyperbolic? Is this something that we should actually be concerned about for the average individual? You know, you're a smart guy and you are a survivalist to a degree. So what does that mean for the rest of us? Sure. First, we shall be self-reliant. We all have heard the stories of the water pipe burst and you can't get water, which actually happened to a front of mine not too long ago. And of course, in 30 seconds, all the shelves go empty of water and people need water. We know that the grid can go down. I mean, there's a black house somewhere. So the world is not going to get any safer. I'm not going to go into a long rant about other foreign threats and trying to bring our grid down, but you've got to be self-reliant. You need to have this stuff. So I realize not everybody's going to want two years worth of food storage like I have, but that makes me comfortable. And the best part of being self-reliant is you can help others. If you do not have supplies, if you're not prepared, well, then you're just another deadbeat who's causing problems who's going to stand in the long line because you can't help others out. So for instance, I have a widow next door, right? I know she has some supplies, but guess what? Because I have so much, I can help take care of this widow. I can help take care of some friends and family. So that's why I think it's important is so you can take care of yourself and not be a drain on society, not be a drain on the government, but also so you can help those in need who might not be able to afford two years worth of food storage or afford as much as you and I might be able to afford. Because I'm starting to learn that this could be a little bit more important than I originally thought. I was originally from Toronto moved down to South Florida and now I'm dealing with all the hurricane chaos that happens. And I've never thought to fill my bathtub with water for several days of drinking water before, but this is a whole new world. So I find that so interesting. What are some other very important, I guess, basic things that people should think about in their day to day, just in terms of survival and survival and not being a burden and what they should be doing. And you know, they're in the condo in a big city. What are the things they should think about? Well, you should have your food storage. We mentioned you should have your water storage. I'm a big guns guy or some type of weapon. So I love guns. You've got to have a way to protect yourself with somebody's kicking in your front door at 3 a.m. Whether that's a knife, whether it's an hatchet, an axe, again, have somebody to protect yourself. And then pay attention. Criminals case people, meaning when you're staring at your phone, what a criminal, I'll tell you the kind of the criminal framework, right? It's called the hostage events attack cycle. And what it means is, okay, some criminal says, hey, I need money, right? I'm going to go to target and watch everybody coming out of the target parking lot. And I'm going to see everybody come out who looks like the easiest victim. Then I'm going to follow that easiest victim to the car. I've been robbed them. And then my buddy's going to be two lanes over. I'm going to jump in the car and we're going to get out of there. That's in a nutshell. So if you don't have your head down, if you're looking up and you're scanning around, they're going to say, you know what? I'm not going to pick that person because they're going to see me coming. I'm going to go after the 50 other people in the target parking lot who have no idea what's going around. So just by having situational awareness and having your head up, it's that much easier not to be attacked. Many years ago in a place I won't name, I was almost kidnapped. Two guys are coming towards me. They don't blend in with the environment. They don't look like they should be there. And as we're about 25 yards apart, they're coming towards me. They look at each other. They look directly at me and they step apart trying to funnel me in between them. Well, as soon as I saw this, I turned around. I took off running. These guys took off running after me. And when people are trying to kidnap me, I've become very, very fast. So I out ran these guys. They never got to me. But if I had had my head down that day in some phone, I would have walked right into these two guys who would have tried to kidnap me. And then we had to fight it out. So having good situational awareness keeps you out of having to fight, keeps you out of being attacked. So that's, you know, an easy thing that every human being on the planet can do. You know, it's so interesting because you always think you're safe, especially as somebody who lives in North America and in the US, you feel so safe. You feel so safe wherever you travel abroad. This reminds me of one story. I think it's a Tim Ferris story where he went abroad. And he didn't think anything was up. And then there was when he got off the plane, there was somebody holding a sign saying like Tim Ferris, like as if, you know, they're the driver or whatever. And then he realized that he didn't tell anybody that he was going to that country. And he thinks that this is, you know, the potential, a kidnapping event that he avoided, because he's like, I never told anybody I was going to the country. There's nobody you should have had a sign there. Nobody knew I was going to be there. And it was some, I can't remember which country. But it's just interesting that you don't expect it. And then it really only has to happen once to be the most devastating, you know, life impacting event that will ever happen to you. Right. Exactly. And he obviously played a grade. I mean, I, yeah, that Tim Ferris story hadn't heard. But he did the right thing. I mean, same thing for me. If I'm going somewhere and I don't tell people exactly where I'm going, I never do. If somebody shows up there with a sign heck no, I'm not going towards them. So you've got to be vigilant everywhere you go these days. What are some other, I mean, you have so many lessons. It's really hard to, to pick. So I'm just going to ask you which ones you think are the most practical or the most impactful that would help somebody in a day to day. And it can be a self-defense lesson. It could be a survival. Whatever things that you think resonate the most with an audience is sort of just starting to consume your content. So one of the classes I teach is how to become a human lie detector. So it's detecting deception. And we go over a bunch of stuff. But I'm going to tell you one of the easiest ways anybody can do it. You don't have to be former CIA. You don't have to be a polygraph for any of that. Is as human beings, we are not made to lie. So when we lie, our brain has to take time to come up with that lie. So if I ask somebody a question, I say, you know, hey, hey, Joe, tell me the last time you stole something, right? Most people immediately answer, oh, I stole money from my parents, wallet, and high school, or oh, when I was in sixth grade, I stole a sticker's bar from the supermarket, right? It's a, it's a quick immediate answer. But if you ask somebody this question and they get the nervous look on their face and they're start, um, um, um, they're trying to buy time to control that lie. So I'll tell you the perfect example. When I'm hiring people, I literally do just what I said. So I get them comfortable. They sit down with me. I'm like, hey, you know, tell me where you're from. You know, we get to, we shoot the bowl for about five minutes. And then way out of left field, I don't even tell them it's coming. I say, tell me the last time you stole something. And again, most people are like, oh, in sixth grade, I stole a bunch of candy from the supermarket, right? Immediate answer. They're not nervous. They have normal human behavior. Well, one time, true story. I had a guy, as soon as they said this, he gets the deer in the headlights. Look, and he's like, well, um, uh, well, I'm like, hey, don't worry about it. We've all stolen things. You know, we've all, we've all done stuff. And he says, well, I worked for a bookkeeping company a while back. It was my last job actually. And I stole a ton of office supplies because I wanted to set up a competing bookkeeping company. And I realized I don't want to be the bookkeeping business. So I need a job with you. Clearly, I did not hire that guy. But he was, he was very honest. He was. Because I mean, after he started having a hang, I calmed him down. And I, you know, I, I, I got it out of him. But just, you know, once you shoot the bowl for five minutes with somebody, come out with a question way out of that field. I mean, I do the same thing with drugs. I say, hey, tell me last time you did drugs. Most people are like, well, I smoked marijuana in high school or I did some drugs in college. But I had a person once, same thing, deer in the headlights, nervous, told me they did hard drugs on the weekend, but never during the work week. Well, I don't hire people who do drugs because I'm in the security business. So that is an easy way to detect deception is law them into that complacency, hit them with that uncomfortable question and see if they exhibit normal human behavior. So it's interesting because the second you do that, even if they end up telling you the truth, their mind perceives the thing that they did as something that would obviously turn you off as the question, as the person asking the question. So they think they they know that what they did is wrong. And that's why they pause on it. They know that what they did was incorrect or they know that they did like probably is not going to be conducive to them getting the jobs they pause on it. So even if it's not pure deception, you actually benchmark how they perceive the severity of the thing they did by how long it takes them to answer. Correct. I want to see how uncomfortable it makes. If you are honest, you did nothing that is outside of normal human behavior, meaning you stole candy and sixth grade from the supermarket. Many of us have done that. That's normal behavior. But if you're stealing office supplies is a grown adult at your last job and a lot of them clearly not normal human behavior. So you're nervous, you're uncomfortable. You know, like you said, I'm not going to like the answer and you're probably not going to get the job. So you get the deer on the headlights looking all the stuff that comes with it. When is there a is there a way to pick up deception even if it's not, for example, something that is that much of a lie. So say you're talking about somebody's past experience and you're saying, you know, what did you do at your last job? And they were, you know, maybe an entry level marketing person, but they're saying that they are the CMO and they did everything for the company. And it's like not a lie, but it's not the truth. And it could really hurt your business if you make, for example, this hiring decision. Are there any other indicators that are so, yeah, there's a ton that I teach. So one of them is pay attention to the direction the head nods because the head doesn't lie. So as human beings, we often lie with our voice, right? And I'll give you the million dollar example. And I don't care what anybody's politics are. It doesn't matter to me. But when Hillary Clinton was running for president against Trump several years ago, she had a interview and I believe was Diane Sawyer, was some kind of 60 minutes to have an interview, right? And so they ask Hillary, they say something to her or Diane Sawyer says something to her like Hillary, you and Bill have a wonderful marriage, don't you? And she says, oh, yes, we have a wonderful marriage and you see her head just slightly. And so politicians, of course, many of them are liars. It's great to watch them on this. So I asked somebody a question like when I'm interviewing somebody and sometimes they'll say, hey Jason, I'm never stolen anything of my life. And I'm like, you're kidding me. I stole stuff of my life. I was the guy who stole candy from the supermarket and this is great kind of thing. And they're like, no, Jason, I'm never stolen anything. I'm watching to make sure there are no matches up with their no, did have a case one time where a guy was like, no, I'm never stolen anything and his head is slightly. It's very slight, nodding yes. And then I know I've got him. So always trust the direction the head nods, not what the voice says. I love that. Okay, is there any any final any final lessons or any final thoughts? Because I have a couple rapid fire that I want to close this out with in a moment, just to pull us some final insights from you. But there's anything that we didn't go into. I mean, we spoke about, you know, all the work that you did with the CIA transition into entrepreneurship. We spoke of some great lessons, spoke about your family, anything that we didn't go into that you wanted to talk about. No, I mean, you asked a ton of great questions. So yeah, I think you, I think you hit on a bunch of stuff. No, that's perfect. Okay. I'm going to do a couple rapid fire to close it out. But most importantly, where should people connect with you? You have obviously great YouTube channel. You have a couple books that you've published. If people want to sort of dive in and start consuming, what's the place they should go? I'd say the best place is go to my YouTube channel. If they just search Jason Hanson CIA, that'll take them right to it. Okay, awesome. All right. So you've had a ton of wins, but what is the most memorable loss? The biggest thing that you screwed up that was like, holy shit, I'm not going to recover from this, but obviously you did. So what was that thing and how did you overcome it? How'd you fix it? Yeah, I mean, I can tell you what that is. It was a painful one. So I've done a ton of business deals and obviously have good contracts and everything, but did it business deal once with a guy that turned out to be incredibly dishonest to con man, uh, done some horrible things to people. So that cost me a heck of a lot of money. And unfortunately, what I learned is, you know, even though you got your contract, people can, you know, bend the rules and the court system isn't always as people can abuse the legal system. Let me just say it that way. Uh, so that was a tough lesson. As you said, I bounced back from it. So I'm just even more careful with everybody I do when he kind of business deals these days, uh, you know, much tighter contracts, much tighter or everything. But I'll tell you a funny story real quick. Many years ago, I was in this big, uh, group where people brought me in incredibly successful CEOs, executives, multimillion dollar businesses. And this was when I was like recently leaving the agency, right? And the guy there just happened to answer the guy who's running the conference like, Hey, and I can't even remember why he asked, but he said, how many people have been ripped off by a business partner or a employee or somebody stole money from you and the business thing, right? Incredibly successful people. I looked up to many of these people. Some of them are very well known and about 60% of the people in this room raised their hand, 60. And at the time, I just left the agency and they were bringing me in from my expertise. And I remember thinking, man, I'm never going to have this happen to me. Like how can these super successful people, 60% of them be wrote, you know, that's not going to happen to me, but low and behold, that did happen less and learn. Yeah. I think something that I've seen repeatedly with people that have been burnt, and people that have been burnt just sort of like the experience of doing business and building things, I start to notice that people do business with people that they've known for a long time. And that starts to become the default, just because I mean, after, you know, meeting your wife and your kids and maybe go to a wedding or a birthday party over the course of a couple years, smart people start to just work within their own circles. It's not obviously always practical, but it just starts to, you know, it makes it so that there's very much, there's a lot less chance of stuff like that happening. When people come out of the blue with like an offer that's too good, that's when you have to put up a red flag. I understand right. My inner circle these days when I'm doing businesses, I'm doing stuff is very tight, very thorough. So yeah, yeah, you're absolutely right about that. When people, I mean, people reach out to me still all the time out of the blue, but I have a team, a very thorough vetting team and probably 99 out of 100 deals. I look at, it's screwed up, it doesn't vet, it doesn't pass muster. So we, you know, we take that 1%. Yeah, that's smart. If you could tell your 20 year old self one thing, what would it be? Well, bam, my 20 year old self, you are going to have a very much larger successful business than you could ever dream of. That is what I would tell my 20 year old self. My 20 year old self was trying to get into the CIA and everything and not really thinking of business. So that would be like, what are you talking about? You're going to have this huge, you know, multi-million dollar business. That would be an eye opener for me. Outside of the fact that, outside of the fact that obviously your business hinges on your experience in the CIA, would you pursue a career in the CIA again or some sort of law enforcement? Do you feel like it does people right going through that? Yeah, I loved it. I mean, it's great training. The training I got was amazing. It's very hard. It toughens you up, meaning it's kind of a boot camp mentality when you're going through the training. So you got to be tough as nails because they're trying to wash people out and get people to quit. You know, if every American went through some kind of boot camp thing, we'd all be a lot tougher and stronger to be good for the country. Yeah, I'm totally on the same page as that. And then last question, if I had credible career, obviously as an agent and then as an entrepreneur, at this point in your life, what does success mean to you? Success means to me. You know what I really like doing besides obviously spending time with my wife and kids is helping entrepreneurs who are not in the area yet. I mean, I really find that fun because I remember myself. So maybe it's an entrepreneur whose business is doing 250,000 a year or 500,000 a year and their goals to break that million dollar mark. I love working with those guys because I look back myself and I'm like, listen guys, I had zero business experience, had no idea what I was doing. You know, it's sheer grit and everything and all that. And basically to say, hey, anybody can do it. It is possible if you're willing to put in the effort. So that's what I enjoy doing now. It's hopefully these guys who are who are more again doing a couple hundred thousand a year, get to the million dollar mark.