Gil Dezer - Developer & Visionary | From $500 Million Debt to Luxury Real Estate Empire

I grew up in really humble means, free bedrooms and one bathroom in the house in Queens, and then when I got into the real estate world, I said, this is what some of it is overkill, some of it's absolutely needed, and some of it is just right. Most developers build towers. Guild Desert builds icons. He turned luxury real estate into an art form, fusing innovation with brand storytelling through groundbreaking projects like the Porsche design tower and the Bentley residences. But what sets Guild apart isn't just the skyline he's changed, it's the mindset he brings. When you're the owner of the company, you have to do everything yourself. You can rely on some people. I have great people working for me. If you can't just expect everybody to do it, you gotta do it yourself. I didn't do anything that's never been done before. I just put components together in a way that's never been done before. Everything's available today. Everything can be done today. I truly believe that there's always a solution. A bold thinker from a family of visionaries. Guild's mission is to create spaces that redefine how we live, move, and experience luxury. To him, a building isn't just glass and concrete, it's culture. When I did the Porsche, nobody wanted to talk to me. I was just crazy idea of putting a car elevator. I finally found a guy who was able to build a form. Once we built it, then now I have all these other big elevator companies saying we might have missed out on something that's really big. Everything's calculated or isn't. You have to feel comfortable and I really truly feel comfortable when I say that anything can be built today. It's just a matter of money. Guild, first of all, thank you for coming out. I appreciate you. This is one of my favorite quotes because I think it really captures your personality. The quote is, if I can't live here, I can't sell it. That's one of my favorite because I think that you have a very high bar for what you do in life, for what you build. But I'll just ask, in your words, what does that quote mean to you? Well, it means I grew up in really humble means. Until I was seven years old, we grew up in a, it was three bedrooms and one bathroom in the house in Queens. Then we moved out to Tendonville, New Jersey. That's where I grew up and went to school and everything. That's where I opened my eyes. My friends had these huge houses and all kinds of stuff. I started seeing how living can be. Then when I got into the real estate world, of course, walking around and seeing all these amazing things, I said, this is what some of this is overkill. Some of it's absolutely needed and some of it is just right. When we look at these apartments, I say, if you get to sell something, you have to believe in it. I also don't get me wrong. I also build smaller apartments, one bedroom, two bedrooms. Again, I would have lived in there maybe when I was 20, 25, but at this age now, where I have the ability to buy something better and set to myself, if I'm looking for this customer, it really all stems from, I see a lot of developers, what I call making fun of the customer. What I mean by that is they show them a kitchen and a bathroom and then they show them some floor plans and they make the customer believe it's something else. Then the final product is real garbage. You got the kitchen and the bathroom you saw, but the only developers who build a full-scale apartment in our sales office to show the actual sizes you're getting, the actual rooms you're getting, because we're not here to make fun of the guy. If you're buying something at this level of $7, $8, $10 million, we just sold the penthouse for $33 million, so if you're selling that level, you got to really treat that customer with respect and the intelligence that he most likely has showing them everything they're going to get. If I wouldn't buy something, I can't sell it. I wouldn't buy in a development where they're showing me a kitchen and a bathroom and a bunch of pictures and some Butler showing me, serving me something that's there today and not there. I've been to those. The joke is, and I'm not going to call any one of my competitors, but you have some of these hotel branded condos where you walk in at night and the restaurant's closed. What kind of hotel brand is this? Versus my places that we don't have hotel brands, but what we do is I've learned higher the best managers who work in these hotels and let them run the condo. For them, it's a no-brainer. It seems like common sense. It seems like if you look at luxury, look at the biggest best luxury brands in the world, and they have to take their customers seriously, or they'll never survive. I don't know why real estate would be any different. If you look at or met us, if you look at any beautiful luxury like LVMA, they have to take the customer seriously. There's reasons for it. There's buyers who just want to buy and salesmen who sell them the dream and sell the sizzle, not the steak, so to speak, as they do, which it works. Everything sells. But I believe that when our customers come in, they see exactly what they're getting. It's a great way of managing expectations. When they walk in, they're not a lot of the same buildings that see the kitchen bathroom. By the time the building's ready, you have half of those buildings, half of those units being sold for resale because the people aren't necessarily happy there. Is that something that idea? Was that something that you've brought? Because I know that your dad was big in New York and he was building in New York, and I kind of know a little bit about your origin story. Was that something you brought down to South Florida from New York? Was that something that's uniquely yours? Well, I'd have to say it's uniquely my father never built a New York. He is a landlord. He bought buildings when renovate them, put new elevators, new windows, and rent them out. Some of them, he would co-op. He would sell floor by floor by floor by floor. That's how he got to start in the 70s. But it's a personality trait. I believe that when you sell something to a customer at this price level, I'm not talking about the guy who's buying a $500,000. That's regular run of the mill kind of okay fine. And we do those jobs. I'm usually a partner but not involved on those kind of jobs, but you make money in those things too. But if you're selling somebody their actual home where they're going to wake up every morning and take a shower and that customer, you actually meet the guy and you make a deal in a handshake, he effectively owns a piece of you. And you have to deliver for that guy. It's very important. Very, very important. And you got to take it seriously. And a lot of people, they're production mills and they're not realizing that they're building people's homes where they live. And I take it very seriously. This is a guy who's going to wake up at brushes teeth every morning. And if the water's not hot, he's going to think about me. And I don't want to be there. So I don't want to be in thoughts in the morning. If you think about what you've built and your definition of luxury, you're already giving over some really good ideas and insights about customer first. And you have to you're building a part of their life. Basically, you're building a part of their life. When you think about what luxury truly is, what are some of the ideas around luxury that you have that could be good ideas for any entrepreneur, something that is just how you focus on customer, how you focus on experience. These are things that are in all of your buildings. But what is it? If you think about, okay, my customer avatar is so and so this person, how do you think through what to give that person? We look at what is that guy in our case specifically, we deal with how does that customer live? How do they live? What are they doing every day? Are they going to work? You know, these people are investors. They own companies. They're not necessarily there. What is the use of this apartment? Is there going to be a full-time residence? There's going to be a second home vacation. And we tailor the product to exactly that. And what I mean by that is we have people who come to the building. They're there for two, three weeks at a time. They're working during the weekend on the weekends, but at the same time, they have the ability to hit a button and order room service to their apartment. Everything is right there, like a hotel without the transients. There's no transients. And what makes our building special, different from all the other buildings in Miami, every one of our balconies has their own swimming pools. So it's the kind of building where if you want to know your neighbor, you go downstairs and be social. But if you want to just leave everybody, leave me alone. You can be upstairs, leave me alone, stay with, do your own thing, stay in the apartment. You don't have to leave to eat. You can have brought upstairs. Exactly like hotel experience. Right. Just like hotel. So you have the experience becomes what you want it to be. And that's what luxury is. And luxury is giving people all the options in the world. Not just option of A, B, or C. You have options of A through one billion, you know? Yeah. I think that when I think about what you're, you are an innovator. I mean, you've innovated with technology. We'll talk about that in a second with a deservator. But I think that if you even go back to like the luxury branded buildings, you've worked with Trump, Porsche, Armani, Bentley. That's already thinking different. When you started doing that, that was not the norm. So what was the, what was the thought process in terms of, because that's a very interesting idea, bringing in luxury from a completely different, I mean, Trump was in real estate. But the other ones were not in real estate, bringing luxury in and then combining it for like this ultimate customer experience. What was the, what was the impetus? What was the thing that allowed you to see that opportunity and then sort of take hold of it going back? I guess a little bit now. But well, in each case, you know, well, so the Trump thing happened. Yeah. And it happened right after September 11th. They were looking for, and we needed, we needed, we were in Sonny Ells Beach, which in 2001, nobody even knew where it was. You know, it wasn't even on the map. It just had incorporated in 1997 as its own city, own police department, all that kind of stuff. So the city was relatively new. Very new. Yeah, very new. And so 2001, we said we need to, we had a big investment there. We started buying properties right before it incorporated. So we were buying motels and little hotels up and down the beach. We owned 27 different properties at the peak. And then the city incorporated changed the zoning code, allowed for high-rise development. We flipped some of the properties, went and bought more. That's a whole story in and of itself. But then we said, well, we need something marketing-wise to put this place on the map to make everybody realize, Miami Beach was great. Sun is South Beach was great. Bell Harbor was amazing. Golden Beach was amazing. That's, that was the great part. Sonny Ells was, was right between Bell Harbor to the South, Golden Beach to North and Adventurer to the West. So we were surrounded by three of Miami's super-affluent neighborhoods. It was just a natural, you know, mix that they were going to come in. Natural infill if you will. You saw that coming out from New York? Yeah, well, you saw it from the airplane. You literally saw it from the airplane. I mean, you know, you saw, because Sonny Ells was unincorporated. There was, in order to get a police officer there, it was 40 minutes because there was no, no local. And so when, when, when that happens, these motels turn into little ski-vy places, prostitutes, drug dealers, all that kind of stuff was going on there. And we were able to buy oceanfront relatively cheap because of it. And so, relatively cheap compared to what it's going for today. Yeah. We were paying at the time $2 million an acre, which sells for today $100 million an acre. So 50x, okay? Yes. It's insane. It really isn't insane. And we're still paying that $100 million an acre now. And the last properties were buying. So we're, we're riding up and paying ourselves a, you know, the extra money. But that's why it's worth that because now the markets have gone up, price per square foot. You know, when it was, when it was $2 million an acre, we were selling at $300 a square foot. Now we're selling $3,000 square foot. So, you know, the world has changed over there a little bit. But, but we needed Trump to really put Sonny Ells beach on the map, put our project on the map, get the right attention. And then we realized how strong this whole branding thing is. I had Trump on television, everyone's the night doing the apprentice. It was like, he was my one hour advertising every, every single night that I was, every, and we had to print the shows that our sales office. And we were pushing that apprentice button. He was hot. And we were making tons of sales. This was early 2000s. I mean, there was between 2001 and 2007. There's nothing you can touch that went bad. Everything was up, but it was like crazy. It was crazy, crazy. So we did, we did, in that time, we did six Trump buildings, 2000 Trump units over over $2 billion sold in Trump, branded real estate. But more importantly, as I found that what the branding really does, it helped put us on the map as developers. It helped put the city, the area, bring attention. My, I remember my competitors were saying, yeah, we're in the building next door to Trump. You know, when your competitors are saying next door to Trump then, then you know you won, right? As they said, we're next door to Portia. So, I mean, then you know you won when that's where the competitors are giving your building as the landmark. So, and of course in 2007, we got caught with our pants down like everybody else. We owed $475 million to the banks. I had buildings closing as we speak. And so it was really 2009 when we actually called for closings. And there was nobody there because the market was dead. And we reworked all of our situations with the bank in 2010. And by 2011, we paid them all off. We paid off $475 million in 2011, which every single unit closed and paid off our lenders like good boys, we didn't lose any buildings. And that for me, that was when my father kind of stepped aside from the business. And for me, that put me on the map, at least in the eyes of lenders, because I was the, I was me and I think one other developer were the only guys who paid off loans at the time. Everything else was deep in the box for closure. They took it. So it was a rough time, you know, that when you think about what you were able to do versus the vast majority of people, when you think, because I always like to pull out lessons like for somebody who's obviously not at your level yet, but is still like up and coming. If you were going to talk about just like resilience, perseverance, like things that you've like overcome in your life, what would be the lesson for somebody who is like an earlier entrepreneur who is going through this like, hopefully not allowing $400 million. Yeah, $475, almost half a billion. I mean, that's a, that's, that's, that is a sobering experience, you know, you're, you're, you wake up and you're, you're half a billion dollars in debt and you're like, holy shit. There's nobody there to close. You know, you had, I had, we had all these units sold. Everybody with 20% deposit, we had the project sold for $1.1 billion. Okay. And with, and all 20% deposit, the values went down by half. So a guy with a 20%, let's say he had a million dollar unit with $200,000 deposit, the not the units now worth $500,000. He's not closing. Why would he lose it? If he closed, he'd lose a half a million dollars basically. We renegotiated with some of them and, and in order for them to not lose their 200,000, but then lawyers popped up, get your deposit back.com and all that fun stuff. So, you know, um, people didn't close. And so we, again, the product was good location, location, location, we were on the beach. We had the right size units. We had the Trump brand still on the building. We, and, and, and specifically in 2010, Brazil took off. Brazil, the dollar was, was weak against the rail. Yeah. And we went in through the top of Brazil. We got some of the best brokers and best clients in Brazil who made a lot of noise that were buying Trump. Brazilians love Trump. Um, they love, love, love Trump. They still love Trump. Yeah, they, they love Trump. And, and so, um, that was it. We, we, we wound up hitting Brazil hard and selling, selling, you know, we're selling almost 30 units a month at a lower price. You don't give yourself enough credit because I know for a fact that you were still making calls, renegotiating. Oh, yeah. I know phone with everything. That's the lesson. That's the lesson. I mean, just like lining it up, the answer is when you're the owner of the company, you have to do everything yourself. You know, if you rely on, you can rely on some people. I have great people working for me, but you got it, you know, you can't just expect everybody to do it. You got to do it yourself. If you're, like you said, if you're the founder for the owner, you got to figure shit out. But also, like, I think that what you're really good at is you're, like you never put yourself above anyone. You're like, you go in the trenches, you, you, you're human to human, you get that shit done. It's my company, you know, it's your fails. It's on me. It's not on them. They get another job tomorrow. You know, I don't know if everyone, I don't know if everyone at the level that you're at thinks that way. You have to. It's yours. Who's going to care for it like you? It's your baby. It's your child, you know? So you got to make sure shit gets done. And I've known to be get frustrated and loud sometimes, you know, I can when, when things don't go my way or things are people don't do things the way I want them to. And sometimes a lot of times, I have to show somebody had to do it the first three, four or five times and then they'll pick up and do it on their own, which is really what, what happened in Trump towers? We were contacting unit owners who had deposits. So it's not like I was cold calling, hey, you want to buy a unit. This guy already had hundreds of thousands of dollars in my pocket. I'm trying to help him out, get a unit closed. So it was just a matter of teaching, teaching the system, teaching the math, teaching the levels where we are and what we could do and how we get it done. And then I gave it to my people who really got stuff done. Would you say out of your whole career that was probably one of the more stressful parts? It was, it was weird. It was scary, you know? You wake up in the morning and then the whole world's falling apart and day after day after day, not just like it was bad. It was real bad. We sent out our closing notices on a on a Wednesday and that Friday, the Lehman Brothers claps, you know, two days after I was like, holy shit, who's going to close now? You know, I mean, and it was just, you didn't know what to expect because I'd never lived through anything like that before. You know, never never experienced anything like that, never saw it. But, you know, one thing I learned that it was never to take away from me is that it's, it's real estate. You can touch it. You can grab it. So the value of it is based on what people are thinking, which is to me, I didn't really like, how do you, you know, why? Why is it based on consumer sentiment, right? After thinking good, value goes up, thinking bad, value goes up. But why? It's the same fucking real estate. It's the same building. It's looking at the same ocean. So if that's really what makes prices move up and down, it's consumer sentiment based on what they're seeing in the news, whether it's based on interest rates, then just sit and wait, you know, wait till they're feeling good again. And so, you know, if you can, obviously, if you have the wherewithal, but sit and wait because it's, it's foolish to reason why things go at the same time, I am that guy who, when consumer sentiment is down, I buy everything I can, you know, because if this guy sees the sky is falling fine, I'll catch this guy. That suite is a success story partner. Now, what does the future hole for business? 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Just go to indeed.com slash Clary right now and support our show by saying you heard about indeed on this podcast. Indeed.com slash Clary, terms and conditions apply if you're hiring. Indeed is all you need. Do you think in terms of like when you, the buildings you build, do you consider them investment plays or pure like lifestyle luxury? I want to live in it because a lot of people listen to this also think about real estate about how I don't make money. How do I leverage it? It's investment obviously because it's a real estate investment and over time it will go up. I don't sell it to people as an investment. I don't think it's not an investment that I would invest in per se to see a return. I'm selling a guy an eight million dollar unit. It's probably going to be a 10 to 12 million dollar unit when it's over. No question about it because if you look at what my neighbors are charging where the markets are at. So I'm giving the guy an incentive to buy now. But he's leaving me at 50% deposit. So I'm like eight million dollar unit. He's leaving me four million bucks. If it goes up to ten million dollars and he made two million bucks, is that an investment? I mean, I'm sure he could do better in the stock market. He'll be up. He'll have equity. When he closes, he'll have the warm and fuzzy. He's got equity. He got a good deal. But is he retiring off of this unit? No. Is that a good investment? I'd say go put your money in the S&P. He'll do better in the same four years. That's where I would call it an investment. But at the same time, at the same time, the investment comes that if you don't buy now, you're not going to get anything at this price. Because if you think it's getting cheaper, just wait. Nothing's getting cheaper. Real estate is going up in cost. Not value. That's where there's going to be an influx of cost versus value. If we have to start buying all this stuff from China with tariffs and all that kind of stuff, the costs are going to go through the fucking roof and it's going to exceed what the market value is going to be. And that's where you are going to see a slow down construction. And that's why I tell anybody whatever you're buying. And a developer came to me two years ago. I'm not going to mention very well known developer, smart people, apparently smarter than me. I'm going to tell you the truth. Because they showed me a project and I'm like, this thing barely pencils out. You know, they're scraping at the financials or not. The finance, it wasn't a great project. It wasn't like, again, I wouldn't invest in it. I can understand other people investing in it. That'll make some money. But it's not, I do home runs. I like to do home runs only. And you can't find home runs all day, but we look for them. So I said to myself, why is this guy even doing this shit? What is he wasting his time to make a 6% return at the end of the day? Now, here we are two and a half years later. The building is coming out of the ground. Tariffs are coming. I'm looking at myself that that guy, that was a bad deal then. So he's fucked. No, no, no, no, no, no. It was a bad deal then, but he'll never be able to build it for that price again. So as bad as a deal it was, he was the smartest guy on the planet because the replacement cost on that thing that he did two years ago versus today can't do it. So if it's a, it was a, his bad deal will wind up being a great deal. And I just, you know, I didn't want to trade four quarters for a dollar and sit there. But yeah, you don't have a crystal ball either. But, but you don't need to do it because it's the same theme over and over and over again. This stuff is not getting any cheaper. You know, 2008-2009 was a shit show, but you navigated successfully. What was the idea about bringing in, because Trump was a sort of like a well-known real estate brand. Porsche, Armani, Bentley, these are not what well-known real estate brands, right? These are car brands, right? Or these are luxury brands, car brands. But when you decided to do this strategy to bring in these names, what was the thought process? It was, you had the idea of brand with Trump. But what was the next thing that made you want to do this? It was, it was an evolution of thought process. We heard that, so we started out with Porsche design. Okay, you have to understand how I got to these car brands. It was difficult at the time. They didn't want anything to do with the real estate. But Porsche design was the, was the part of the Porsche company that did the sunglasses and the lighters and they had the retail stores. So I went to the Porsche design company and they were the ones looking to do a licensing, knowing that they had the name Porsche and the logo in their name that they can maximize on their Porsche design. At the time, I believe the whole Porsche design part of the company was doing something like $80 million a year in revenues. Oh, it's small. It's very small. Yeah, right? It's the tail of the whole Porsche company. Porsche company doing $9 billion a year. So easy to get to, easy to make a deal with and we made a deal with them. It was the Porsche design tower. What had happened half afterwards was Volkswagen did a leverage buyout on Porsche. They took over the company and they forced the sale of Porsche design, which was owned half by Porsche the car company, half by the Porsche family. So they forced the Porsche family to sell out and then I got tucked into the Volkswagen group. And that's how I got my way access to Bentley and all these other brands that we have that we've been talking about and to them. And so that's how that happens. And they were, they were okay. So like the small subsidiary willing to realize that it was not easy. It was not easy. I had to convince them. I said, look, Donald Trump, the only thing he has is his name and he gave it to me, right? He didn't have, he wasn't even have a product. He wasn't manufacturing cars or anything like that. These guys, you manufacture cars. You need a lifestyle component. We'll, you know, we sat down with them. They were, we really guided them through the process because a lot of the things that we taught them, you're dealing with executives who are not at the same level as our customer pool, if you will, you know? And so I represent the customer pool and say, this is what the customer wants. This is what they need. This is what they, and they go, oh, yeah, that's great, great, great. And so, you know, they didn't say no on me on anything. Few things like they, we have to stop production of our brochures because the brake calipers were not red. Things like that. They were obsessed with the details. Oh, for sure. It's still till today. I mean, they checked the building and everything else to make sure that, yeah, of course. No, that building is a hundred percent Porsche. I mean, it smells, breathes, looks, everything, Porsche. And the same way Bentley is going to be the same. And so the concept of the car elevator started. My father owns a building in New York City, which is a car dealership on 271th Avenue. It's called Manhattan Motor Cars. And it's a Porsche Rolls-Royce Bentley dealership over there. And it's a five-story building. And you drive in, you press one of five buttons on the elevator, goes up, opens the door, you drive right out. We said, okay, how cool is this going to be? Maybe instead of pressing a button, you will have an RFID or not. We go to the fire department with a design. Hey, you drive in, yeah, picks you up. Yeah, it got, they said, this is great, great, great. No fucking way. And because they said, we don't want you starting a car in the middle of the building. And so that was a whole other process of how to, of how to, what, what is Porsche have to do with real estate? We said, let's make the building for the car lover, for the guy who wants his car and his living room. And that was what our idea was. What really happened was there was something I didn't think whatever of. But based on the fact we have always South American customers, they love the fact that it was the security and the privacy and safety of them going up and down from an apartment without seeing anybody, without seeing, you know, with everybody know who they are. Instead of jumping on board and being like, and I know you probably have the patents and the IP lockdown type. But instead of being like, okay, how do we replicate this? This is a really cool feature. This serves the same clientele as us. It's like the immediately, it's like the blockbuster to Netflix, right? Yeah. They're just, they're, people are so slow. They're afraid of chill of all. They're afraid of new things. Yeah. And when they don't understand something, they're quick to say no. And it was a little education. And especially to developers, I would have expected by now that developers would have figured this out what I'm doing. Yeah. figured out that this is, you know, the, the whole reason we're sticking in $85 million elevator in a building, right? Do you understand why? Yeah. Well, because it's a privacy, it's a convenient. It's a, it's a, it's a, people don't get it. No, that's the abstract effect of it. But there's a financial reason. There's a financial reason I went and patented this shit. Yeah. What's the financial reason? The FAR, you understand real estate, you buy a specific plot of land. Yeah. It has a floor area ratio FAR in Europe, they call it GFA, gross floor area where the FAR on that site allows you to build in the case of the Bentley Tower, 600,000 square feet of net, sellable square feet. Okay. That is the actual inside of the apartments, not including the balconies, not including the stairs, not including the elevators, not including the parking. So by now placing the parking adjacent to the unit, yeah, I get enough. I sell it as part of the unit and I'm picking up an additional 50% on the building. So my, my FAR was 600,000 square feet. I'm selling out 900,000 square feet. What does that turn into in writing? Yeah. I'm picking up, I'm selling my square 50% more revenue than the neighbor on the same size plot, the same size land. And yes, it's cost of being an elevator, but 300,000 square feet. Yeah. Well, what do you do? You do the math. I'm doing it at 1500 bucks a foot. That's an additional $450 million in revenue. You spent 85 million for foot. Okay. Yeah. That's why that's where the, I mean, if you were to ever call me a genius, that's where the genius comes in, because we figured out how to milk every single penny out of this building by adding value, by creating this elevator system, but every other developer gives away parking, and I'm selling it at the same price per square foot as the unit. So it's an aha moment and I am surprised at every other developer in the world is not calling me to do the same thing. I got to get it. I don't understand where the, but again, it's because it's something new. They're not used to it. Some others are trying. Some others are trying to, you know, to do buildings where you drive in, drive out, which fire departments are going to shut them down on it. I'm the only system where you don't have to start the car. That's my patent. You come in with your passenger in the car. There's a little satellite system slides out, lifts the car at least a little like chopsticks. The same way kind of like a tow truck gets the front. We do all four wheels. So the car is in park, passengers in the car, engine off, pulls you in the elevator, the deserverator, pulls you up to your floor, spits you out in your own personal garage, two steps away from your front door. And because two steps away from your front door, you have to buy that garage. And if you don't want to buy the garage, this building's not for you. You can go next door. Have you had pushback? Oh, yeah. Oh, you charged me for the garage. Yeah. Well, it's part of your unit. You know, I mean, they don't charge me next door. Okay. That's, we don't have it. That's where you need to live. Go have some valleys, sweat in your car and bang the car up all day long. Yeah. If it's not important to you, you know, if it's not important to you, if you really think about it and do the math again, I have, I'm selling four spaces. It comes to square footage wise, about two million bucks, not cheap yet. It's five hundred thousand dollars of parking space, which if you go to any city anywhere in the world and you want it to buy a parking space, that's the price. All right. And Hong Kong, they're going for two million. New York, they're going for a million. So to spend half a million dollars to have the car right there in front of you, how do you do something that's never been done before? So I know people that build technology software has never been done before, building something physical that requires engineering architecture. It's like, it's not easy. There's a lot of it. It's expensive. It's time consuming. Well, I, here's what here's what I got to be honest and say I didn't do anything that's never been done before. I just put components together in a way that's never been done before, meaning what we took is automated parking. That's been around since the 70s. But never it was always done to save space to put cars next to each other, save the driveways, you know, and make it a more efficient parking garage because garages are expensive. So I just took that same thing and adapted it in a way where we're, I'm not looking to save space. I'm looking to bring a passenger in the car. So we have to put a lot of passenger safeties. And the answer is, yeah, I'm not an engineer, but we hired the right engineers who said, hey, how can we get closer to this and how can we get closer to this? And guys would pop in and know where and I didn't understand what they were doing. But later on became some of the most valuable guys in the whole project, you know, I'm the only elevator in the world with a sprinkler system in it. Should the car catch on fire, you know, there's a sprinkler system in a moving elevator with traveling. And so they, you know, at first we said, oh, we're going to have a traveling water cable. And he said, that's going to be a fucking problem. You can't do that. So we went to head to a high-miss system with these huge scuba tanks that sit on the cab and they missed out of fire. Yeah, I mean, but you just got to sit in the thing and figure it out. Everything's available today. Everything can be done today. You know, and if it can't be done, it's easy to make it today. 3D printers and whatnot. Anything can be made. Yeah, that's true. So it's very true. And like, listen, I don't know, you just never take no for an answer when it comes to innovation, when it comes to building. I know like, I, because I truly believe that there's always a solution, you know, and the really, there's a solution. There's always a solution. You just got to think, you know, and sometimes I'm not in the position to think because I don't know the solution, but I got to, I sit there and I force my people to think. And I ask them questions of three-year-old child would ask and get that juice is going to, you know, but why can't we do it this way? And why can't we do it that way? Even though I know that their answers are going to be, but what about this and what about that and what about this and what about that? And just force experts who, they're experts, they've been doing this their whole life, you know, force them to think, you know, force them to think the other way. I just want to take a second and thank Cornbread Ham for supporting today's episode now. Cornbread Ham CBD gummies have been this really nice addition to my wellness toolkit. I don't use them every day just when I want to win wine after those extra busy weeks, but they're perfect for those moments when you want to take the edge off and just find your balance, really just shut off from work. And what makes them special is how Cornbread Ham crafts them. They only use the flower of USDA organic hand plants. 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Each show is under 30 minutes. iDigress helps eliminate complexity, complications and confusion in your business with frameworks and strategies to achieve true, scalable and sustainable success. If you're an entrepreneur building anything, you need to listen to iDigress. This is one of the most useful business podcasts. Trust me, go do yourself a favor and listen to iDigress wherever you get your podcasts. Talk about innovation for the elevator, but also talk about innovation just in general. Like I want to know, I want to know stuff that you are planning for maybe Bentley, but also for like the next building after that. I know Bentley is already kind of figured out. That's not changing, but what are like ways that you think of innovating something that is like one of the oldest industries in the world really. Really is the oldest. Yeah. I mean, one of the main innovations we did of Bentley, I don't know if you bit the sales office. Yeah. Okay. You saw the you saw the balconies. Yes. Yeah. It started out at the Trump International Hotel. One of the engineers from Porsche came over to the state of the hotel and it was a windy day outside and he said, I went on the balcony of your hotel room and I cannot light my cigar. And I don't want to go inside and light the cigar and walk out because they'll stink up the room and blah, blah, blah. And I can he says, can you above your balcony really? Can you close it with some sort of accordion or or sliding windows? And I said, that'd be cool, but you can't do that because then it becomes interior square footage. So so the we we thought and we we came up with on the balcony at Porsche, we did the balcony with the balcony rail, but then towards the edge of the balcony we did four floor floor floor ceiling panels of glass on the balcony. And what happened was now you have an area at Porsche of like a eight by 10 area zero wind on the balcony because the wind gets trapped in that little spot there. And so he says, shit, this thing works really well. Let's blow it up at Bentley. And so we Bentley has an additional skin an additional skin of window on the building, which nobody else does, but what that does is it gives you a three sided balcony. So now we have 1500 square foot balconies with zero wind on the balcony, even when the wind is blasting at you. It's it's it's going to it's a game changer Miami for whatever reason doesn't do a lot of indoor outdoor. And now we we have really because of the wind, the weather, the rains tomorrow every five seconds, you got to pull your cushions and pull your cushions out. We solve that. We solve for that problem. You don't have to touch your cushions. You don't get any wind on the balcony. And so we put a swimming pool on the balcony. We sunk it in. We have a barbecue. You can have and we invite our customers. We have dinner outside there. And we show them on the windows days look nothing flying off the table. This is an exterior extension of your living room. And so I think that's that's been a game changer. Nobody else has done it yet. They're all going to start copying me soon. I know it as they do. It's just fine. You know, but but because that's not a patentable thing, right? I mean, but but we did figure out that if you add a third wall to your balcony, when you do innovate, how do you protect like your IP? How do you make sure that people aren't just copy? Now it's it's wild to me that people aren't copying you yet. Well, at some point they will. Well, so here, so here I asked you the question and answer before how different differentiating. So at when I did the Porsche, you know, nobody wanted to talk to me. I was I was I had this I was crazy idea of putting a car elevator and even the elevator people thought I was nuts. I finally found a guy in Chicago who was able to build it for me. He was a specialty lift company and does all kinds of specialty lifts. Once we built it and as we did a proof of case or whatever they call it, you know, a proof of concept as they go. Then now I would I have all these other big elevator companies saying, Oh, shit, we might have missed out on something that's really big. I went ahead and I patented the concept. I have a worldwide patent on the deservator taking passengers in a car in the elevator adjacent to a dwelling unit. And there's good. It's a deeper than that. But I have a patent. Why? Because there's there's a revenue on this thing. It adds value. I can add hundreds of millions of dollars to a developer's bottom line. You know, so that's why I believe that this this anybody who wants it. So so now the shift we made from Porsche over to Bentley, I'm having Otis elevators building the elevator for Bentley. Otis is the largest elevator company in the world. And now that also gives me the ability to go sell this elevator concept everywhere. So I can go to Dubai and say, Hey, you want to you want an elevator? My guy's at Otis a building for you. They're building like crazy too. Yeah, but in China, you want an elevator? My guy's at Otis a building. So now with Otis in the picture and partnering with us. And hopefully that's going to come out to be a great job. So that gives me a worldwide reach on this patent that that's costing me like $300,000 a year to keep the patent alive. But you don't see them copying other parts of what you build. Not yet. Now, I mean, there's there's a one building that's doing something similar. There's another one in Brazil. A lot of them so far driving and driving out that I've seen. But you know, we're going to call the local fire departments and ask them how to have that's legal. You have a 25 year pipeline of projects, correct? Probably more. Probably more. How do you when you think about what you're building into the future? How do you manage that when markers are going to change, administrations are going to change, everything's going to change at some point? It's right. I mean, you know, when you've got that kind of stuff, it's all right. So you have to specifically the 25 year pipeline we have is all different product types. So whatever meaning all that I have 1800 units of of of workforce housing that we're planning on doing, we have a 2000 unit project of super luxury with a canal and everything on the intercostal mall. I have four more ocean front sites, which is probably another, you know, 250 units each of those of condos. So, but each one is the world goes up and down for each one of us. One day, rentals are hot, one day real, real, real, real, real hot, one day condos are hot. So over that time, you know, we'll just ebb and flow with the market. I mean, when you when you build these things, it's not about the market. You're in it, you know, you're in it for for two administrations, you know, from the day you start to the day you stop, it's six to seven years. So it's it's not just who's in office that day and buyer sentiment that day. You're going to have to live with these things forever. Do you see some new technologies in the real estate space or just in like not even real estate? It's like luxury and lifestyle. What's something new that you will eventually be excited about incorporating? A lot of robotics. I think robotics are going to be a super game changer on everything. We are already looking at them. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I am already I'm working on making a machine. They haven't already, but they don't have it right. Package delivery, you see you live in the house. You don't have the problem. I absolutely can't. Okay. Yeah. So Amazon today is a force, you know, and it's a force of how everybody's getting their stuff in their units. And it's been a real headache for for buildings. The package rooms and the buildings and organizing it and and what unit gets what and how do you communicate with the with the resident of his stuff is here. His stuff is not here. Is he in residence? Is he not in residence? I think a robot to deliver to the units and have signed the received and all that fun stuff. That's that's the way it's going to be going. And I think that's what absolutely needed. You see them in some hotels as a butler. Yeah, I see no. But those things don't carry up proper payload. They carry a payload that's like, you know, for for a six pack of coke. And you know, that's the problem with those and and also the technology on that is already, you know, dead. So so like true luxury and true convenience, it's getting I believe my tagline is luxury is privacy. So and that's me personally. It's not for everybody, but luxury. But if I can go and accomplish everything I need without having to ask anybody for assistance, that's luxury. And what I mean by that is, you know, if I have to ask for my valet to get the car and that's a problem. That's a pain in the butt. Just because there's one more person I got to deal with and one more person I got to I got to make my hair look nice and smile. And you know, I want to just be able to come and go as I do in a single family home, right? So we do that in the place. I want to be able to just like ordering Uber Eats, you know, on your phone where you don't talk to a person. How much people love that? They order Uber Eats and food. Magic food comes shows up. You can have that downstairs. You can have the same thing. And it comes up eight in 10 minutes. Be from the guy who you knew who was cooking it. You know, the ingredients. I mean, a little bit letter, you know, a better level of that kind of experience. I mean, and and and then having the ability of just, you know, shutting out the world or coming downstairs and and meeting same people in your same socio economic situation, which is the other party. You want to be living with people like yourself, you know, because I've made the mistake of building a building once where there's one bedroom units, 800 square foot units mixed in with 4,000 square foot units. And there's a two tier system and two second class system in that building. The guy with the one bedroom, he's downstairs saying, we don't need six values. And the guy with the four thousand says, we need four more values. I waited four minutes for my car, you know, so it's a you know, it's a lot goes into this. You know, people don't realize. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I know. And people have to live together. You're creating a community. Yeah. And you can't escape each other. You can't escape each other. See, the community has to be all like my dead residents, you know, and people of the same interest. We've left we've left buildings way, way earlier on in my life when you're just renting just because the building wasn't the right, like we were doing well financially or we were doing well in our and it was a mix of like, you know, kids that were maybe two people sharing a condo versus families like at every level. It doesn't matter what level could be a four thousand square foot could be bigger than that. Whatever it is, you always want to be around people that are sort of living the same life as you. And I think that that's just a pleasant experience. You want to be in the right neighborhood. That makes the living experience. Exactly. Who wants a bed neighborhood? You never do. That's what that's that this is life. That neighbor will you don't want to go home when you have a bed neighbor. Also, just last last comment on just real estate and there's some other things that I want to talk about just like luxury and lifestyle that you've included, but also I want to talk about some of the people that that buy your units and what luxury really really means. But just on the topic of like future projects and South Florida in particular, you are also Florida. Why do you believe in South Florida so much? I know that you've been here for forever, but say you never ever, you know, made a mark in South Florida. Do you still believe in this part of the US? Well, I was definitely here at the right place at the right time. In this place goes up, goes down, goes up, goes down, but every time it goes down, it comes back up. And it comes back at double. You know, so I believe in the United States, but I also see what's going on everywhere in the United States and the population shifts. And so we are very fortunate to be here. That's why I say, you know, and like I said earlier, this is not stopping. More people are going to come. If you come here on vacation, it's very hard to leave, you know, oh, I know. I came here six years ago. Yeah, and if you have the ability to pay as an uproot and leave, if you're working from home, if you know, you know, that people will do that. Why not? No state income tax? I saw yesterday somewhere a New York, New York state and Florida state have roughly the same amount of population and New York state being a democratic democratically run, they're paying, they have double the budget, double the annual budget of Florida. I mean, why? Why? Because they're shoveling some snow. I mean, we have hurricanes. That's the offset. You know, so I don't get it. You know, there's people, this is a well-run state. DeSantis is awesome. Yeah, he's really an awesome guy. And so, you know, it's people appreciate that, you know. I know that people aren't investing in real estate in California or New York or a lot of the other like very democratic states. But is there anything else that you would, you know, I know that you are entrenched in Florida, but are there other places that even somebody who's like early on starting maybe they want to buy a, you know, their first property for investment? Where else would you look? I mean, if you listen to the numbers on immigration and population growth, we've expanded by 5% the size of this country. And the last couple years based on Biden letting those people, now they, they can't necessarily afford houses and they'll double and triple up, etc, etc. But over time that will trickle down into a tremendous amount of housing needs. And so any, any relative level of housing is going to be lucrative or as soon as you can do it right in the right neighborhoods, etc. Again, we're in a microcosm of super hand. I am building in Orlando. I'm building, we have a thousand units of rentals. We have two buildings done, 350 units done each, and we have the third building about the start. So we're in all those kind of markets too, and we see it in, and, and it's Florida. I mean, yeah, it's all Florida. They're building more universals, billion in the park. It's just everything's getting bigger and bigger. Do you think it's better to be close to the real estate you invest in and just know the region versus just look for the most strategic state or opportunity? It's definitely a localized business. Absolutely. And when you, with your feet on the ground, you'll do a lot better than just like flying around and I see this and I see that also managing it, managing the business, managing the relationships within the business. When you're local, it's more important. I see a lot of these New York developers come from out of town and they get to launch hand it to them. Subcontractors will charge them a different amount just knowing that they're one hit wonders. They're only here because the market's hot today and they're not around. Versus me, I've been working with some of the same subcontractors for the last 20 years. So it's a different pricing in that respect. So there's a lot that goes into it being local for sure. And I even said to myself, when people say, let's do a project that I say, I'm not set up to go build in that place. But find me the right developer who's the guild desert of that town and I'll put money behind them. For your buyer, for your person that lives in your buildings, do you think that profile of a luxury person's ever going to change or are there standards, there are standards? You see them changing at all in the near future. What's changed is that there's always the luxury buyer who's extremely discerning and requires. But what's changed is you get that lottery winning, in money, a lottery winning, a basketball player or a singer or something like that. They come in and you have to kind of explain to them how to conform to everybody else. Did they have a lot of special requests? No, more like we have a special request of them to behave and not smoke pot in the elevators and that kind of stuff. That's what it is. When you move into these buildings, you have to surround it by ladies and gentlemen. You have to behave like ladies and gentlemen. I'm sure you have opinions on new money versus old money. Money is green. It's all the same. I sold a unit to a guy who was an absolute class act, absolute gentleman, even an elegant way carried himself and everything else. He bought a unit for me and I said to him, he was retired. I said, what did you do in your past life? This was like, I'll tell you what, this was early 2000s. He said to me, I was a UPS driver. And I invested all my UPS stock and UPS went public, early 2000s, around then. And the guy became an overnight millionaire after being a UPS driver. And so this is a guy, a regular joke, but he didn't look like a regular joke. An act like a regular joke had the serving taste and he bought a nice apartment from me, which he bought a $300,000 apartment which today is worth $1.2 million. Easy, maybe even more. Real estate in my opinion is one of the best investments. I truly believe it's one of the best investments. I think that more people should be in real estate in some capacity, whatever it is. I mean, outside of the fact that it is a physical asset that you can touch, you can leverage as well, which is also great. But I find that people, if you're just running a paycheck, it's very easy to just take all that paycheck and just spend it. And then you make a little bit more and then lifestyle creep. And I mean, this is more of a less than people that are very early on just starting out. But if you have a little bit left over, like put that money into a real estate deal, find a way to invest its own compounds, put it into, you know, if there's a sort of a blue chip stock, something like that. Yeah, because it's getting harder and harder to put a little money in real estate now. It is getting harder and harder. So I think the answer is like, start sooner than later. It used to be deal sizes were 5 to 10 million, and those same deal sizes are now 50 to 75 million. Yeah, I know. I know. And so it was easy to jump in, but now it's... Do you think that somebody who actually has made some money? So say they have, you know, say they had an exit, 50 million dollar exit, 100 million dollar exit. These are, these are decent sized companies they've built by this point. And they want to, they want to get into real estate. And just because you're a good entrepreneur doesn't mean you're a good investor. That's one thing that I've learned many times. You got to learn the game too. It's another game. You got to learn. Do you think that they should put their money into real estate? Do you think you should put their money into a fund? Do you think they should manage your product? Like, how do you think through when people come to you for real estate advice? Because I'm sure annoyingly all your friends who are not in real estate probably ask you. They have money. How do you get started? It depends on the person. I mean, are you a passive investor? Are you an active investor? Do you really want to get involved? Do you care? You just want to put your money and wake up and look at a bank statement. You know, real estate has a bit of active investing in there. So if somebody's getting into real estate, I mean your first building was 80 million dollar building. That's the decent sized building. Is that a big building to jump into for somebody getting started? Oh, yeah. That was huge. Yeah. So I mean, it was a story of how we got started in that. We had partners initially. My father got into an argument with the partners and bought them out. And I was working for the partners learning, you know, I'd never built anything. I was 24 years old, 25. And when I father got into a fight with the partners, they were going too slow. He said, hey, just in the time we've been sitting here, the land went up by 10 million dollars. And so they said, if it went up by 10 million dollars, past 5 million and buy us out. And he said, okay. And he paid 5 million dollars to buy them out. That was the first day I had a cigarette in front of my father. I was like, what the fuck are you doing? You know, I mean, we don't know what we're doing. Never built anything. And my father was at a lot of confidence in me. He said, you're smarter than all those three guys in the room. You'll figure it out. And it was a good confidence, a good pile of the back. And we figured it out. We figured out construction. They've been building since the days of the pyramids. So, you know, it's not that crazy. We're not brain surgery. You got to figure out how to do it. And that's why by my third building, I got bored of building regular buildings. We started putting car elevators and swimming pools on balconies and seeing how we can over complicate the most general situation. Yeah, I don't know. I feel like people are scared to take risk like that. I think a lot of people will be scared to take risk. You have to feel comfortable. And I really truly feel comfortable when I say that anything can be built today. As far as molded, you can mold concrete in any shape. The steel, the computers behind it can tell you how to make something stand up. And so, anything can be done. It's just a matter of money, right? So, first you got to start with anything you can be done. Then you've got to figure out how to make it economically feasible. So, where you still make money on the job. If you don't have it, how did you get that, you didn't put up the 80 million cash you had banks behind you and stuff like that. We had, yeah, well, yeah, we had a construction loan of 60 million and we had that. So, that's a good size construction. Yeah, yeah. From a bank, there's no longer a business. How do you get them to trust and bet on you? It was not easy. We had to, you know, we had to promise, we had to show, we had to do with this, we had to show sales, we had to show that we had the construction team, the contracts were all eyes dotted teeth crossed. Everything was all properly lined up. And we found colonial bank to give us a loan because the regular banks were not willing to talk to us. It's one of those things where, you know, they tell you, for this job, you need experience. Nobody's going to hire you without the experience. But then where do you start? Where do you need the experience? It was one of those situations, for sure. We didn't have experience. Nobody wanted to give us a loan. But then once you get experience, now everybody's your best friend. Same with the car elevator, you know, and nobody wanted to touch me when I was building the desirator. But then once I built it now, I had, oh, just Koneg, everybody running after me. Koneg, everybody running after me to do it, these are the elevators, you know, so, yeah, no, it's a, it's a good lesson because like, I mean, like, I get it, like, you know, you didn't start with zero cash on that first building, but a $60 million loan was a lot. Yeah, that's a lot. It was big. And you could make the argument that a lot of people could replicate even the in a slightly smaller scale that first build, if they're smart. Today, for sure, today, today, to get a $60 million loan is easier. And I would think. And today, with, there's so much money out there, if you have the right, it's the business plan. Okay, so everyone I know is so Florida, the first time they hire a GC and a team, they get screwed. How did you not get screwed? Or did you, and you figured it out in spite? You know, it's, it's one of those, what do you really call screwed? Of course, you're gonna get screwed. Yeah, I get screwed all every day because I'm the guy who's paying for everything, you know? So, you know, but sometimes you get screwed and you can't take it personally because it is what it is. You know, there's things the architect left off the plans. There's, I have a doll in my office that looks like one of my engineers where you can actually press and choke his, choke his neck. So my guy's got it for me. So I don't want to mention the guy's name, but I choke his neck because I want to, you know, that's the guy you want to choke. But these things are where they are. And, you know, fortunately, we have, we price our things right. We have a cushion inside of it to absorb any hiccups that come along. But, you know, you just, you can't take it personally. Just keep my move forward. I love it. Yeah. Um, okay, a few more. What do you call them? Uh, uh, well, with a, my gillism, gillisms, yeah. That's what my, my team calls my, my philosophical, uh, some of them are good. Yeah. Some of them are very good. I, I wrote out a couple that I think. So just tell me what these mean to you and what these mean for people that are listening. Success is not a number. Success is the feedback that I get on these buildings. Yeah. So you don't chase money. I have, I have enough money. Fortunately, thank God. You know, I come over to, you know, I have enough money. Yeah. The feet, yeah. Come on. What better feeling that? You know, somebody's like, oh, my God. I have a guy that he says, you created my life. He says, you created, but the reason I go downstairs and have breakfast is because of you put that restaurant there and blah, blah, blah. And, you know, very like, well, profound things. You don't think about that stuff. You know, um, so they, and they appreciate it. And they appreciate it because I did set it all up for them. I got the chef. Who's the guy there? We set up every, you know, the, got a miss one star chef. Yeah. Well, that's now for the next hour. You know, that's a big one. Yeah. Um, every no gets you closer to a yes. Yeah. Very true. Don't take no for an answer. Don't think no, you know, and I, and I, and I, to the point where the word no for me is a really like, like, I don't like it. You know, and, and so, uh, and, and I don't, I also like when people tell me no, I have a, uh, in Spanish, they call it become cup of trussle, you know, like they, they tell you no, and you're like, you want to even more, you want even more. So, um, and so that's where I never really took no for an answer. And, and, uh, and I also taught my staff in part of our training that we do in my hotels and on all my properties. You're not allowed to use the word no. If you can't do something for somebody, you can say, we, we, we can't, we don't do it this way. We can't do it this way, but this is how we can do it. And never, never give the negative without offering the policies. Yeah, find a solution because, you know, just to say, oh, you, I'm sorry, you can't do that. No, I, it was France. The piss me off. You ever been in France? Anything you asked for, no, no, no, no, no, no, I want to punch every French person. Tells me I know possible. You know, why is that? I can't get ketchup. No Pizzaboo. No, yeah, I'm sure you can get, I figure figure it out. Yeah, I mean, I couldn't park the car after four o'clock, no Pizzaboo, no Pizzaboo, like, you know, everything there with those French people there. But that's the difference. There's two very different types of people in this world, right? There's people that'll say no, or they'll come to you with a problem, or the people that'll just figure it out. And who do you want to be around? Right. Exactly. You want to be around. People just figure it out. Um, okay, last few questions. Uh, but before I go there, uh, I just want you to leave the audience with like, where should they go to connect with your work, what you're working on, website, social, I don't know what you want to drop. But Bentleyresidences.com is our latest project desert.com is our website. But I don't know how well maintained it is. That's fine. That's fine. 3059321,000 is our main office number. You can reach us there. Um, yeah. And and we, we're doing, I'm projects going on right now for, for us. I'm doing the main focus is Bentley. I'm also partners 50% partners in the project in Hillsboro. It's a rosewood in Hillsboro where it's beautiful. It's really going to be fucking well. I gotta say, I'm not as involved as I'd like to be, but the designers there knocked it out of the park. It's going to be an 11 story building where the first entire floor is all amenities. It's really going to play it be a place you're going to want to live. Okay, last questions. Uh, first one would be what would be out of all the words of wisdom that your dad taught you growing up? What was the most important idea or thought or piece of wisdom that he left you with? My father told the story. I don't know if people know the story or not. This is Michael Deser philosophy. Okay. And it's awesome. And you see, he tells the story of the young bull and the old bull. And they're all at the both at the top of the mountain. Yeah. And the young bull says, the old bull. He says, Hey, Dad, Dad, look at all the cows down there. Let's go run really fast. Run down there and go fuck one of the cows. And the old bull says to the young boy says, son, let's walk slowly and fuck all the cows. And so that's the answer. Don't run just to fuck one of them. Take your time. Fuck them all.