Aubrey Strobel, Head of Communications at Lolli | How To Market Bitcoin And Crypto

Welcome to Success Story, the most useful podcast in the world. I'm Scott DeClaire and today I'm sitting down with Aubrey Strobel, who is the head of communications at Lollie. Lollie is a platform that allows you to collect Bitcoin while you shop. Very similar to how honey, if you've ever used it, allows you to apply coupons while you shop online. So Aubrey is the one who crafted the take-to-market strategy, the marketing, the comms, the PR, everything that created the massive market penetration and share that Lollie has today. They're one of the most notable consumer-focused Bitcoin crypto blockchain brands. So we're going to dive into Aubrey's origin story, how she got involved in crypto and blockchain and Bitcoin. We're going to speak about what she's done with Lollie, some of the strategies that she's deployed. And then we're also going to speak about the future of Bitcoin, blockchain, and decentralized technology. This episode has also been sponsored by Gusto and Ladder. Gusto is your one-stop shop for all payroll solutions. Ladder is redefining how you purchase life insurance. They have special offers for all success story podcast listeners. Stick around until halfway through the show, you're going to get those special offers. Alright, let's jump right into it. This is Aubrey Strobel, head of communications at Lollie. So both of these sponsors have offers for all success story podcast listeners. Stick around until about halfway and you'll get those offers. I really hope you enjoy the show. Thanks again for joining me today. I'm sitting down with Aubrey Strobel, who is the head of communications at Lollie platform where you earn free Bitcoin while shopping online. She discovered crypto back in 2016. We're going to go into her crypto and career origin story. She worked for a few different blockchain projects while wrapping up the journalism degree. She is a regular contributor to coin desk. She has had her work. And if I'm not mistaken, an op-ed featured by NBC, she speaks globally on crypto and blockchain and defy, of course. And really, Lollie and Aubrey are household names in the crypto space and Aubrey is an amazing job of building a community around yourself and Lollie. So thank you for joining me. Very excited to dive into your origin story, how you got involved in blockchain, what you're doing at Lollie. And then we can go into some more relevant industry conversation about it. But thank you for joining me. Great. Thanks for having me on. No, I'm not. No, my pleasure, my pleasure. I've seen you all over Twitter. So obviously you're marketing well. You're doing your job well. Let's back it up and walk me through how you got involved in Lollie, how you got involved in blockchain, just your origin story. Yeah, I, you know, blockchain crypto, all these terms we're talking about. Still, I think even in 2021 in this in this bull market, which is maybe tapered off into a bear market now are still kind of confusing to a lot of people. So I hopefully will keep it relatively like in the lane, but, you know, I got into Bitcoin in 2016 had some friends that were actually working on Wall Street that were buying crypto. And, you know, when you have the traditional finance guys buying crypto, you know, who are usually these like proponents of ETS and stocks and all sorts of things like that. It is sort of a signal is like something shifting here is there something that I should be paying closer attention to. And so I think when I did my own research and looked into crypto, I saw a great need for why, why don't we have 24 or seven training? It's such an archaic system. A lot of, you know, why are banks closed? Why don't people have access to their own capital anytime that they want and, you know, for me, I think, you know, freedom is is a value that I hold very near and dear. And, you know, as an American and I feel like that has been democratized in terms of the internet, but hasn't hadn't really been done in finance and it was just sort of like why isn't this happening. And I think that always stems back to there's there's too much power in certain certain institutions, people that they don't they don't want people to have an easy access to capital. And so got into Bitcoin, bought Bitcoin actually at a Bitcoin ATM down on this by the Staten Island ferry, which is sort of a weird way to get involved because most people just buy up an exchange, but bought Bitcoin out out of that Bitcoin ATM and then just kept buying, you know, Bitcoin Ethereum, other tokens and wasn't quite sure about like the future, which, you know, people they get in they say, what should I buy? Which I buy and really I was just drawn to Bitcoin because of the foundational elements, the scarcity, there will only be 21 million Bitcoin ever created. And that makes it sort of like a digital gold compared to, you know, some other cryptocurrencies that can be mined continuously like dogecoin, you know, I'm sure people watch your show have heard of it or have some awareness of this like she put in new dog token. But, you know, the reason that crypto is great or Bitcoin is great is because it has that that scarcity component to it and that there is no way to create more Bitcoin. So unlike, you know, what's happening right now in America with inflation and in many countries around the world, this is sort of a problem to fix not only the ease and accessibility to capital, but also hopefully, you know, a hedge against inflation from governments. And so that's sort of what drew me in from the beginning. Yeah, but I got my started a crypto PR firm and that's sort of how I got in in the door and kind of moved there to lolly. So that's a first of all, that's a very prolific thought if you were just so this is you you were in a journalism degree and and you just went down the rabbit hole like you you totally went down the rabbit hole and and that's what shaped your entire career. It's just I always find it interesting how people how their careers form because obviously I'm assuming when you went into journalism, you did not expect to end up in crypto at all or blockchain, but you just sort of gravitated towards that and built on it and I appreciate also the sort of the definition and the explanation because you're right. Crypto blockchain, if you're in it, it feels like the entire world gets it, but if you're not in it, it's still, you know, it's still very foreign and I think that that's actually not to go jump into lolly just yet, but I think that that's actually why lolly is so interesting because it's bridging that gap between this complex new concept almost that people have to understand. Understand and then something that they can actually use versus yeah, you know, when you go when you when you are in a group of technical people who get blockchain who have bought into crypto early on. Those aren't the those aren't the average people that you really want to get to adopt the adopt Bitcoin blockchain, whatever right, you want to get the moms, the dads, the grandparents to adopt it, but anyway, so I did me to go off track that I just thought it was an interesting point you made about how it's it hasn't been fully adopted. And that's that's something that you that sort of like brought you into it, so continue, continue, keep going with with your story, so how did you, you know, you started looking into crypto, you got involved in it, you worked for crypto PR firm, you said, and that was which one was that. Well, I like to get back to the point about you made about getting into journalism and I think kind of into crypto a lot of people who go into journalism sort of going for this like altruism of hoping to shed light on broken systems. And so we're injustices are trying to be a watchdog for the public is sort of how I at least saw journalism and having a degree in that, you know, my parents were teachers and that was sort of like a service based profession educating people in a classroom, I wanted to educate people at large and. I had the opportunity to do that I had an offer from Fox and ABC to be a broadcast journalist and for different reasons, both of them, one of them I turned down, one didn't work out and I'm actually really grateful, I think some of those things that happened early on in your career. You know, you look at them at the time and you're like, oh, this would have been really great, I wish this would have worked out and I think it's really the best thing that could have happened for me and so I got into crypto through talking to my friends, but then I saw an opportunity to work at a PR firm to sort of share the story to educate people about Bitcoin because I didn't think it was a very large problem and a problem that I could help solve or be a voice for. So there weren't at laxman for over two and a half years working on projects that were just way too early, it was just way too early, even now it's so early and I think when you're in the industry, you want to shake people and you're like, this is the future because of these reasons, and I hope, you know, you can see that too, but people, ever people right now, you know, they're just trying and the main stream group of people they're just trying to take care of our kids pay their bills, they they're not. Looking out, you know, much more beyond that there's a lot of Americans that don't even have more than a few hundred bucks and they're they don't even have a savings account and they're checking account and so. To say to this future of finance and in these terms and you know that we throw around and these defy and blockchain and all these different terminologies, the normal person just doesn't have time to really sit there and figure that out and that is why lolly is great. And, you know, when I was introduced to Alex Adam in the CEO of lolly, he pitched me this idea, I said, this is where we're at in the market, this is where we are at in the cycle, we're not doing these ICOs or initial coin offerings that I was working on or security token platforms, just yet. I think we need to get people comfortable with holding an only Bitcoin and sort of this idea of being their own bank first and lolly allows people to do that in a very easy way, not everyone sees themselves as an investor, they see themselves as a shop or though I think most people have our custom to shopping online. And so that that bridge is a is a easier bridge to get people over and so. And so. However we can get Bitcoin people's wallets however we can get people owning Bitcoin is a good thing for me I don't I don't care how that takes place you know if they're buying on exchange it's the same thing if you're earning it or if you're mining it so lolly was like a project that I thought I could really get people the moms and dads the aunts and uncles into the door with. But yeah that I mean meeting Alex was just like. You know the most random thing I had a friend that was working at bar stool who. Had a guest heard what Alex was building and said you got to talk to this guy put us on a text thread and out said let's jump on a call today jumped on a call pitched him what I would do for lolly and then sort of the rest of his history honestly he was like this is what I want to build I was like I know what you want to build let's do it. And we've been there get it lolly for two years next month so well it's almost next month. So it's it's worked it's worked out so so lolly seems to be. So you're you're you're you're you're you're the thing that drives you your why it makes a lot of sense lolly is the vehicle to do that and. I guess my question is is are there other platforms that are that you see that are bridging that gap in your opinion or do you feel like lolly is and I know there's going to be other other things but like having a true. Market share market presence like lolly that are really enabling the average non technical not entrenched person in blockchain to understand and start to use and just get comfortable with the concept or is lolly somewhat leading the way in this because I haven't seen many. That do what lolly does and like you I love how you said that it taps into something that everybody's already doing anyways. Yeah, I would say lolly is leading the charge is one of the biggest crypto companies in the space and I think because we're not after just big coiners it's not just a big coin club anymore it's getting it really is getting every single person possible in if you look at similar companies like honey which was acquired by PayPal for four billion dollars very successful company they have I think it's 30 million. Users to their platform that's more than any crypto company has I think coinbase has 30 that 30 million sign ups and I don't know how many active wallets because a lot of people have left their crypto on their exchanges and don't daily trade and there's a lot of crypto just sitting that will always sit because people forgot about. You know whatever their password is or just have not downloaded the app forgot about it but we're really after people earning every single day and lolly actually allows you to earn big coin every single day not just even by shop and we just launch the app you can tap this. Treasure chest loot box and it gives you free Bitcoin you win you know it's it's a few Satoshi's Satoshi's are the pennies to the dollar so you know it's it's not convenient obviously you can't. Bitcoin's worth around 32 thousand dollars right now it's not convenient to trade in one Bitcoin if you're thinking about it you know so Bitcoin is divisible by many other units and so you can earn these Satoshi's are fractions of Bitcoin on lolly every single day which makes it a more active wallets and coinbase or perhaps any of these larger exchanges because people are just finding ways to make it a part of their daily behavior accruing money so yeah I think that's that sort of. A way that's becoming a part of people's everyday life that they can track the price of the coin and it's sort of that thing when you get skin in the game then you want to know what the price is doing once you have ownership then you care and you're now you're tracking it now you're talking to your friends about it and hopefully that's what lolly is achieving in some capacity with our app. So yeah no that that makes sense to me now I'm I'm also very curious you did have you did have a journalism background you were working in PR to some extent but you have this founder who wants to take a product to market that realistically has never been done before. What I'm curious what the pitch was and what the strategy was to make the successful because you've done it well so you know what's the marketing play for a brand new crypto blockchain project to take it to market. Well I say everyone sort of trying to do what we're doing now when when we launched in 2018 I think that the crypto companies were trying to take themselves very seriously because they they didn't have that validity and no one really tried it it was sort of like a joke still you know crypto was what silly internet people were doing and even now I mean there's there's people still probably feel the same way for a large part. So a lot of these crypto companies really trying to dress themselves up act like banks and that's exactly what we were trying to get away from we're not trying to be banks anymore we're trying to have this idea of freedom and so I think really lean into what makes you unique no matter what that maybe is at your personal brand is at your company brand. And and lolly just never took a self seriously I mean it's name is lolly it's it's funny it should be comfortable it should feel like approachable you know and that we want to be the approachable bank not the bank that shuts down on you for Columbus day for any reason that you can access your funds that you know tells you you have a withdrawal limit who you know is a tell you at the teller at the bank that says you know so I would close your account for some reason that you don't know all those reason that bank make banks not fun is like the exact opposite of that. What we're trying to do we're trying to be the fun bank you want to keep your money with lolly keep it growing we want to add different incentives like interest accounts and things like that so I mean the idea that I pitched was that I can you know this is a product that can get on good morning America that can be. As you know your your mom like we're saying could understand this you know my aunt she buys my cousins vitamins off of vitamin world and gets Bitcoin back for my autistic cousin and that that's like the impactful thing is the humanity which I think sort of stem from my journalism degrees stem from some of the PR stuff that I've done it any any way that you can humanize a brand. Is impactful no matter what that may be and just realize you know really just pitched the idea that all all companies are media companies and they've been trying to be but they didn't realize that they were doing that for quite some time so the content they produce whatever it is. People people want to talk to the people they don't want to talk to brands they don't they don't they want to feel comfortable they want to engage they want to you should have your users want to spend money with you and make them feel that way when they're shopping so that that sort of you know I think not the exact playbook of how we did it but. The framework like I think it's smart I think the framework smart and you're doing it like you go go to go to Aubrey's Twitter like go to go to lolly's Twitter like it's it's just fun and we were speaking before this we're saying like you know how this is not even a blockchain thing this is just like a marketing in 2021 mentioned it every company is a media company my opinion every person should be a media company to and building their own brand. So walk me through like the framework for people like this is just a great marketing lesson how you market lolly how you market it on different social channels well I don't know everything you do because I just see some of it but it walked me through that. Yeah. I just want to take a second and thank the sponsor of today's episode gusto gusto is the easy online payroll and benefit solution set up for small businesses. So really gusto is payroll benefits onboarding HR all in one place and it helps you accomplish all of that but keep in mind it is built for the business owner it is a people first platform it is the most user friendly tool that I've ever used and this is really just to remove all the busy work all the admin work away from running a business. 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So if you go to gusto.com slash Scott you get three months free of payroll solutions there's no limitations on your account. gusto.com slash Scott sign up and you will remove all of the headache when it comes to running your business and you can now work on your business as opposed to in your business. gusto.com slash Scott I promise you this will get rid of all the pain points all the headache this will be the best business decision you've ever made. Alright let's get back to the show. Well I like to say for people who are watching this and they may not know how to guide their company or it maybe it's just your personal brand I would say you know just start today because there's so you might feel like it's too late some people feel kind of intimidated by these platforms that maybe that they couldn't have a voice there I think just start today and be consistent with your content number one. I'm lolly on Twitter really we've made a huge meme play and I think people undervalue that in in a way and people companies for a while would say that interns were running social media channels and it's they have no idea what they're talking about would you put your entire brand voice in the hands of a i'm not saying a 2021 22 year old kid couldn't run a great brand for you know someone but I'm just saying that. Does it know the brand voice somebody who doesn't know the brand voice that's what you don't want. Exactly it's not just it's not just a summer job or someone we give someone to do because it's not important it's so important and it needs to be treated that way and people you know make jokes about memes but there is meme advertising like hidden messages within meme like activations that happen it's like a new strategy is going on and so people even argue will be chief meme off. You've chief meme officers in the future because that kind of content is important for companies to relate and it's easy engagement so we've made our Instagram sort of a meme account or Twitter account puts out memes but it sort of just trends with topics that are happening so it's just be really really in tune with the internet's voice. But we also have other channels where we offer you know the best Bitcoin back deals that you can get on law but that's more of a deals focus social media account you can go there for that but if you're going to the law account you're going there to be entertained to hopefully learn something about Bitcoin because I do feel like. Another part of our strategy that I thought was really imperative that we had to had to get right was educating people we can't just bring them in and then not educate them you know like once you have Bitcoin we want to hopefully explain to you why it's a better money than people have already. And how to take care of that money because Bitcoin while it is in some ways very simple it can be very complicated and we want to lower those barriers to entry for people who you know maybe they want to take their Bitcoin off of law and put it onto a cold storage wallet or wallet that's not connected to any devices it's just a name for that sort of wallet so. We want to be a resource for people we're trying to help them in every way possible so I think the educational aspect of that creating educational content we've been doing that on YouTube we've been doing that on tiktok YouTube shorts has just come out so we've been trying to utilize that it's a little clunky right now but the platform but we're trying to utilize those channels and then you know obviously Instagram reels and. Really anyway we can just meet our user we've been doing so much education and just sort of a Bitcoin 101 60 second guide tell you how tell you what blockchain and tell you what Bitcoin is tell you you know tips things that you can learn about in the crypto space and yeah it's been successful so far but I think it's just really had you in the content side. Yeah so so that I think this is a just so I think content marketing you're nailing if people are listening watching this go check out go check out lolly's social channels for. Some practical advice and some and just some some best practice like we you know I look at the companies to do it well meme accounts do well white the chair will is funny it's things that people want you know there's how do you win a content you make stuff that people want to share educational funny things like that that's people want to share with their friends family whatever. So you just apply that to business and also you know but you you've also put yourself out so that's another thing that you do that's a little bit different than not not everybody does that I i'm a big fan of putting yourself out there and building your own brand you said even I don't know if it's a video of I think you put out videos of yourself as well you said you put it a video once a week so you've assumed this. This personality that that's now associated with the brand that's also something so walk me through why you decided to do that as well because not everybody does that other people morning brew for example they do a lot of Twitter stuff and now you have the guy that runs the morning brew account to be a phenomenal second he has a little bit more of a profile but still it's a it's very heavy on the you know the faceless funny content on Twitter but you're doing a little bit more so walk me through that. Yeah I mean some of that stuff people may not want to do a traditional head of comms is not usually making product speeches at conferences and walking through those things I feel like at a startup you kind of make yourself accessible and any way you can and I you know I had that background Brad cast journalism and there's just skills that you can find and parts of your career that you can apply later on and so being on camera is something I feel very comfortable familiar with doing so we create. Quality we created a lot of TV which is this weekly Friday show where we run through the Bitcoin news of the week we do like a meme review we give you the best Bitcoin back deals and then we do it giveaway at the end so there's a little something in there for everyone and then we keep it about a three minute show so hopefully people are being educated on what's going on the market and in a fun way that's not intimidating that is also being told in the right way because the mainstream media can obviously change the narrative and you know we all know how the news cycle can be it's not always like the most accurate. It's like a trail of what's actually happening and so that strategy you know YouTube is the largest search the second largest search engine and people kind of forget about that you know Google everyone's trying to rank for SEO and Google why not YouTube why not become this source that people want to go to to learn about Bitcoin on YouTube there's a lot of people that are already doing that but hopefully we do it in a more digestible way people think about SEO strictly as you know Google but YouTube has one of the largest search engines and so if you can get early into it's not all industries obviously the crypto space is a little bit more recent so getting in there and while people haven't totally taken over YouTube is a good opportunity so that's sort of what we're trying to do over at Lolli get that content out there trying to educate people as best as we can and hopefully that will keep them into the space for the long term and we're really just trying to convert people not just it's I know people hear about these tokens that are like these short term get quick get rich quick scams that's not what we're trying to do we're really trying to promote a revolution or a financial shift for people so hopefully that's that's the you know the goal hopefully and you know Lolli ranks high when it's all said and done as a resource people looking to learn and earn Bitcoin and you and you I think that's one of the main things you have this responsibility to be an educator because you are that consumer product and there is so much there is so much bullshit in the industry and that's what that's what's really important that the people that you know the entry points in the industry are the good actors and I think that that's something that you're doing you're doing quite well so even like you know you can you can brag a bit like what has Lolli's growth been like over the past I guess two years since you've been running their comms and by comms is that is it a stress to say VP marketing are you running everything are you just running comms you have a team what's your so comms is marketing as well mostly the brand side and influencer side just as you need to Lolli that went first of all we're up to 300,000 over 300,000 users when I started I think we were at 20,000 users so it's been quite a jump we've seen crazy month of her month growth during the past six months and it's just an exciting time to obviously be building you know in this space which is generally and with Lolli you know we have a lot of influencers we just raised five million at a pre-series day and we just actually closed our a so we'll be announcing that soon but the pre-series day we had input thank you very much we had influencers sort of be a part of these rounds so it usually we have a VC lead the round and then have other people creators actually come in and invest in Lolli because we do feel like those influencer activations are kind of better when like any like I was saying have they have skin in the game binder or just you know equity in a company they're more likely to promote something that they hope succeeds and so we have people like Michelle fan we had Serena Williams invest in the last round and Alexis Ohanian lead the round so you know people that can promote on their channels is almost a better tactic than just traditional PR because the engagement in the reach that some of these people had like Cody co for example put out a 30 second add for us to add read on his one of his channels and we saw a crazy jump and sign up to Lolli after that and the real power of these creators to influence their audience and get them to understand Bitcoin and projects that they're invested in and that they're excited about is unreal and not even fully tapped into I know influencer marketing feels like it's you know everyone's doing it and has been played a lot of people aren't and so I would I would you know I guess pose the question to a lot of these traditional companies you know PR is not the total strategy or a lot of that is influencer and so we have some more influencers that are coming around in the in the A so they'll be announced too and they can drive you know uh sign ups on their own channels and that really stretches so so far compared to maybe just how did Lolli mentioned in the CNBC article which is still has value it's still good but who reads all the way down to the end of an article you know some people are listening to podcasts they'll hear that add or you know who's watching someone's YouTube channel will still see Lolli there for sure so it's it's just an interesting way and of how people are consuming content I think we're moving away from traditional aspects of finance or moving away from traditional finance of marketing of PR and there is a huge shift that's happening I has been happening for a while but I think has been really I would consider people to take a look at that I mean I think it's been happening since basically the pandemic but it's it's been sped up now and people are re-evaluating a lot of the systems that they used to on trust and that's reading our news articles that's their banks that's everything every there is a yet so like mad you know massive shift in in many institutions like in obviously you're dealing in in disrupting finance and financial institutions but also like you nailed it like everything has changed the way we market the way we sell the way ever the way we communicate over the past two years it's been like a like a digital transformation on steroids and live like forced on every industry which I think is also very interesting so you know it's just great to see like how yeah you're working in leading edge blockchain that's great but it's not just that it's also you're leading the way in marketing and influencer marketing and how you communicate with your customers and how you present information and how you and how you bring people in and build a community around the people that you want to use lolly and to try lolly I'm curious when when your dealing because normally if you have a company of course maybe if markets are if if you're in a bull market or a bear market in a traditional in a traditional sense it would of course affect some companies but when you're dealing with you know lolly that is blockchain and Bitcoin adjacent does the shifting markets impact signups you know customer acquisition or does it seem to not have an impact at all I just want to take a second and thank the sponsor of today's episode ladder a little bit of context before I speak about ladder ladder offers life insurance but the reason why I want it to work with them is because I personally am a huge advocate of life insurance and the reason being the past two years with COVID a lot of people have lost loved ones fortunately not I haven't lost anybody in the past two years but I have lost people friends far before their time you know years ago and it usually happens that when 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story and you can get instantly approved if you just want to start to investigate I think that's a great idea if you want to purchase you can also like I said get approved purchase for up to three million dollars online in about three minutes they'll talk to anybody so I would definitely recommend you go check them out um and do yourself and do your family a favor and set yourself up god forbid something happens you just don't want to have that stress and that burden on your family all right let's get back to the show yeah I mean when people when the market's up and it's crazy hot like it was I think the peak of Bitcoin in this last run and we'll see where it ends up this year uh was around the Coinbase IPO so I think that was end of April um and you know we've had definitely steady sign ups but I think I think what has happened in the past two years is a change that is not going to be completely undone yes I think you know there's obviously more sign ups when it coins at an all-time high than when it's not an all-time high um but I think the behaviors and the changes and what we've seen how we've seen people approach finance has changed drastically and that's talking about people who are on Robinhood buying you know the mean stocks or doing whatever that I think there was a shift in traditional finance a shift into crypto all these institutions are adopting it in some capacity so while yeah it's obviously more advantageous when the market's hot um with lolly it's actually better to be you know earning Bitcoin at lower prices and so that's where the educational aspect comes in because if you're earning Bitcoin at 60,000 that's great but right now you could be earning it at 32 and hopefully you know when those rewards that those rewards lock in and in a few months you could have paid off for the item that you bought so that's the sort of mindset in the way that people sort of should be thinking about um their money you should always be getting a kickback for anything that you're purchasing to that whether that be credit card points whatever reward points the the system is so gamified now you should really be taking like full full of income so you can be buying things on lolly getting Bitcoin back at low prices during what you want to call a bear marketer or whatever um and getting credit card points too so it's thinking about you know your finances in that way and under that lens I think that's sort of our job too of just educating people at how they can be saving the most money earning the most money sending themselves up to the best future possible and yeah that's the now now I think that this is one of those tools to be able to do that one of one of the many tools that I'm not being you know you mentioned there's the roadmap for lolly and you're looking at potential interest products you're looking I think you said you were building an app at one point I don't know what that app does but this is sort of like the first step in in creating that that reward focus and that customer focus product is tapping into a completely new market so what I'm just curious what what is on the roadmap for lolly what's what's next yeah so obviously Bitcoin's global and we want to be a global company right now we're only US focus and the idea behind Bitcoin and the philosophy of you know Satoshi Nakamoto the autonomous creator Bitcoin was to have Bitcoin reached all parts of the world and it does that right now you can only earn in the US so we're we have US merchants that's how our partnerships are set up but expanding internationally to other countries so that people around the world have the opportunity to be earning with lolly everyone has lolly on their we just launched the app for iOS we're coming out with the app for android hopefully very very soon it's it's almost done we're gonna try to get to our android users and then yeah we're gonna basically offer just different sort of products that make it more intuitive I think what's really great about lolly and are the kind of the UX UI that we have is that it is so seamless where people shouldn't feel like they're using blockchain technology because you're everything people are not going to be crypto experts they don't want to be you know they think they're not interested in DeFi they just want some sort of store of value some sort of way to to hold on to their well and so I feel like that's sort of more the lane that we're we're trying to achieve if nothing complicated you can sign up in 30 seconds you can get going but you are using Bitcoin you are only in Bitcoin so it's like the the seamlessness of it people don't need to know the nuances like the internet you don't need to know how the internet works to use the internet so why would you think it applies a Bitcoin and a crypto and then I guess just you know I'm going to draw out some career insights from you just like some rapid fire questions at the end but this is probably a question that every every podcast that our interview would would ask you but I have to ask because it's on this show so future of Bitcoin future of blockchain but also you know like where's Bitcoin going to be in 10 years from now 10 years so Bitcoin's only been around for about 12 so that feels like a crazy jump I've been in the space for half the time Bitcoin's been around and it feels slow and it feels fast all the same time I would say that you see developments like El Salvador adopting Bitcoin as legal tender in their country which is great I think it'll sort of start with countries who need their their currency their fiat's hyper inflated they need another and then hopefully expand out from there I think it's not going to come without a fight I think anytime that there is power people don't give up with power freely you look at history history of time just even in our country and how America was founded it's not something that's going to come easily and so I think there'll be some bumps in the road in terms of price and and things like that but the the internet's currency it'll be a internet currency that everyone has access to and the applications that are built up on Bitcoin and the company's building around it will be a lot more simple than it is right now you wouldn't really think about it as cryptocurrency you'll just think about it as money and hopefully it will make for more level playing field for people all around the world to transact which is the dream and the goal definition of of a Bitcoin maximalist does that mean that it will completely replace entrenched institutions eventually is that what that definition I was I hear it a lot and I was going to ask you if you are one but I need to get the definition right first so what does that what does it mean exactly the Bitcoin maximalist maximalist is someone who just leaves in Bitcoin and only holds Bitcoin so they see it as the future they're pro Bitcoin and Bitcoin only they don't hold alternative coins or altcoins such as Ethereum or sort of other protocols so they they're very much a purest if that makes sense in the crypto space yeah yeah yeah I own other coins because I think if there's applications like Ethereum that allow for DeFi and I think you can build upon it it's very interesting I don't know you know where five space is going but I think there is you know the applications that are being built and the smart contracts are being utilized on DeFi are game changing in the same way that the way that you know Bitcoin is changing the bank situation you can do lending for a lot of reasons you don't need lawyers to operate some of these deals that are happy not DeFi and so there's obviously a market for that to happen and you can create a bridge and start having to deal with lawyers and you know other institutions telling you you know what rates you're borrowing and lending at you can sort of figure that out on your own so there is a future there's a path there but in terms of store value and coins that are going to make it a long term Bitcoin's the answer and this is not financial advice yeah yeah no no we'll let that's the caveat and and then I guess I'm just curious what are some other you know consumer applications in blockchain that people may not know about that people should go check out yeah great great question I think block five is great I think you can you know we don't have an interest earning right now but you can I guess it's not super consumer but it's it's what yeah it is consumer yeah I think it's a great way for people to get on like just onboarded that you know want to even just make extra extra money on their Bitcoin if it's not making enough money already and then there's I would say like it just depends sort of what you're interested in if it's more Bitcoin focused or if you're more into these other currencies you know I would lead you a different way I'm really excited about the NFT space I think that's really cool for creators and consumers to so places like open-sea marketplace it's a great way to sort of start using Ethereum and like figuring out how NFTs work creating your own art selling your own art I think that's great there's so many different creators there didn't have a place to sell didn't feel like crypto is for them and now they're selling their artwork on these platforms so that's really interesting as well that's a whole other episode I'm exactly I saw that was what you wrote your op that was the piece that you wrote I think for one of one of the pieces you wrote for NBC or CNBC I can't remember which one it was but that was what it was about about scarcity and NFTs and whatnot oh my god the whole other thing that I'd love to go into if that's like yeah I called the artist scarcity it was like talk about people's NFT that went for you know quite a bit of money and so just how how our perceived notions of about value are formed because value as a concept and this could be a whole episode too is totally changed what what has value and what doesn't have value and that's that's that that is the whole conversation at his core from from that's what that's what people speak about when it comes to to Bitcoin and and and where it gets its value from and then what actually is value and how do we actually apply value to certain items and it's very it's a very interesting conversation okay so let's do some rapid fire career insights you've had an incredible career you're working in a bleeding-edge space you're killing it you grew lolly obviously with the help of an incredible team but also you're raising a series a so you know credits do or credits do and you've done a really good job with that so people want to learn from you okay biggest challenge in your career how to do overcome it sorry so is rapid is I no no no by rapid I just mean like I know you want to like it's like Friday when recording this you don't want to spend like another like 45 minutes going through some career questions so I just like take as much time as you need but they're they're you don't have to go too too in-depth I think it was sort of knowing when to leave a company when the end of the road is you know you've you've done all you can do and I'm ready for the next beginning I think that when you're younger you feel like you need to stay or be at a company for a period of time to validate yourself and I don't think that's totally true I think I wish I would have trusted my gut earlier when I first knew you know I'm ready for a new challenge and move on to something else because I think I just think if there's something it's hard to treasure gut early on your career and you feel like you need to do all these things but I really just feel like there's no rules anymore and you can you can really go out and make and do whatever you want this is my whole pitch on the shift from traditionalism to modern day it's good advice and I think that that's something that yes it's difficult earlier on your career but it's more important to be okay with that now than ever when nothing is for sure and that's something that you know the past few years have definitely told us no job doesn't matter what it is is secure because you can be gone tomorrow exactly if things don't work out so set yourself up for success future prove yourself yeah I think that they're the traditional shift from your parents used to work at companies for 20 30 years out of this loyalty and companies are businesses while it's fun to grow something I want people young people especially to know that if the company couldn't pay tomorrow they would fire either things today they would fire you and it's important to see your company as a team sort of a family and I think a lot of maybe it's more start-upy places to do that way you will go and work for like a hedge fund or big bank there's something like that you get more of the traditional aspect of it it's seen as just a job but I think it's always important to know that you have just as you know much say in the relationship between yourself and the company as they do so very good advice okay so the biggest misconception that you had about Bitcoin blockchain whatever when you went into the industry and how is that perception changed over your career this conception is that it was being used for money laundering and only criminals use crypto and I would say that it's actually easier to trace transactions on a blockchain that it is to get out of an ATM and then do some dirty dealings with money yeah exactly you get 20 don't mean bills are obviously they are they're marked but like you could buy money under a mattress you get money can go anywhere you never find it again you'll never know where it is after it's on and crypto is a ledger there are a lot of these cryptocurrencies and Bitcoin is on a ledger unless it's a strict privacy coin pretty much track all transactions and so people used to like to throw that at the community to try to say that it wasn't here for good reasons or was just you being used for listed purposes and it's totally not being used for that you know I'm sure in every single industry there is corruption of some sorts and people are always going to find a way to make something bad if it's good you can make it bad but yeah that's just not true no that's fair and I've heard that I've heard that before but here you the I think that the community has evolved and I think that that stems from a lack of really understanding of what it was more than anything but that's I'm not gonna lie there was this silk road for a period of time people were using it for bad but that's not what it is now and but people are always using cash and all sorts of gold and diamonds whatever you want to some asset has always been used in a bad way if it can do it it will be used in that way um if you could tell your younger self one thing what would it be um that harder on yourself I would say um I'm under the belief that there's no passion there's a quote from Nelson Mandela you know there's no passion in life by planning small or living a life that you're less capable of living and I think that in most circumstances I've gone for raising my hand making the jumps that I could have um but I think if I could have done it even more or just pushed myself a little bit harder in different circumstances it definitely would have paid off um but yeah I'm pretty happy with where I'm at right now I just think that it's always hard to be sure of yourself when you're so young I'm sure of everything all the time I like that that was that was that was a that was a powerful line bed harder on yourself that's that's good that that's quotable I like that um yeah one person who had an incredible impact on your life who was it and how did they impact you they teach you something etc these such great questions I love them I'm gonna have to say uh my mom really impacted me and uh every time a personal level or someone that I know it would have to be my mom she's just unlike any person I've ever met in terms of just a truly good person um but she taught me to have empathy in a way that I think helped me develop my interpersonal I think I can read even as well which is added to my career in a way where I can understand situations I'm in read a room really well it just made me so self-aware now I don't know if I had it as a child but I just remember this instance when uh we had gotten them with a hike at off of uh this mountain by ASU when I was growing up in Arizona and there was a woman that was just wrapped in this blanket and it was the middle of summer and I was sort of an observant child but I asked my mom about this about that and um to this person's homeless you know they might need food would you like to get food for them and I was like yeah I would love to do that and so that that was one of my earliest memories of my mom also encouraging kindness and encouraging it's not just the awareness that you have for other people in the room it's like how can I help them and how can you know what are the needs that they have put myself in there she is looking I possibly learn from this person or what they're going through and she's just a really beautiful person uh anytime we pass a car what we were meant to go this way because we're meant to pray for these people and hopefully that you know they're an accident and it's just a different mindset of like thinking about other people and I don't if I think like if I didn't have my my mom as a mother I would have had definitely been a shittier person she's like the best person just the best you just you just makes you have so much empathy for other people um and I learned it all from her amazing um can you recommend a book podcast audible something somebody should go check out Bitcoin focus or just general anything no no anything that you anything that you've read that has had an impact on your like doesn't matter does not have a Bitcoin focus all right I'll give one Bitcoin focus and then one not the Bitcoin standard it doesn't talk about Bitcoin the whole time it really is just an evolution of money and how we've gotten to where we are today and I think that actually makes people understand Bitcoin more not just learning about Bitcoin it's how is how has our systems failed us in the past and how has governments failed us how banks failed us and how have we gotten to this point where we need an alternative so that's my recommendation for Bitcoin and then I think a book that I've returned to a different periods of my life I think is always a great to reread because art literature movies all these things they can have different means and different parts of your life I think is a young person you know when you're sort of in your working years and then when you're older is um two days by more uh two days with Mori by Mitch Album and it's a it's a really good book about life's lessons as someone's sort of dying from uh ALS so it's an interesting it's just an interesting read makes you put things in there. Good examples come perspective yeah those are those are two two new ones two well you know as like I said I haven't had a lot of people that are as into Bitcoin blocking you are so I expected the Bitcoin standard um or something like similar like that but never never that other one so that's a good that's a good recommendation for sure I love when people bring in like non-business books because I don't know there's a lot of business books that I keep you know they come up again and again and again and I like learning from half the reason why I started the show is to learn from people that have perspective that's just not a carbon copy of every other business perspective out there so I think it's that's it's a good place to learn from yeah I just like the book because it's like a lot of the life lessons also can be applied to business I think you don't have to get a business or it's self-help books to find parallels into different parts of your life yeah exactly exactly okay um and then last question uh what does success mean to you success hopefully would be helping someone else breathe easier and someone alleviate some stress from people's lives and hopefully I'm trying to do this at a large scale um I I have I've had a few conversations about this recently and I think success sometimes just feels like fame or notoriety or all those things but there's also success in this way where I was talking to actually Alex see of Lolly about um just the impact that you can be remembered for just the smallest things um there's this woman that I used to go to this restaurant it was called Louvies in Arizona and she would always give me you know as a little kid she was even this flower from her hair and it was just this kindness she she just worked a normal job at a diner but I remember her 20 years later and it's like these small gestures that you can do for someone that that is remembered for 20 years I sort of hope whatever I do if that's helping get people into Bitcoin 20 years from now that they're like you know I remember this one girl just told me about Bitcoin and now I have set my I have a retirement account or something like that that hopefully that that is success I also would love to have a family one day and a beach house in Jersey so I would love a storehouse if that's not a storehouse no it's good well listen um you know what I think you're I think you're uh you're you're you're you're living you're living some of the um some of the personality traits of your of your mom more than you know just with that answer that's at least that's what I see um it's a that's a very nice that's a very nice definition of success ever garlic the beach house aside that's that's a good definition of success I want to help people but I also if I have a beach house at some point in my life and like okay if I'm by the beach that's all I need just put me by the other thing I feel that I feel listen that's why that's why I'm in Florida right now you're in the wrong city yeah you're in the wrong city I am okay okay let's see uh where do people go to connect with you uh website social or whatever you want to get twitter dot com at obry struggle follow lolly sign up for lolly lolly dot com and then at tri lolly uh that's twitter's my main channels and then you know we have all our social channels linked on our website so you can follow us along there but definitely sign up certainly free bitcoin with lolly that's that's that's my pitch awesome that's it that's all i got that was uh that was for